Filed under: caylee anthony
Caylee Anthony
Caylee Anthony Day by Day Since the Begining of The End
- Anthony Lazarro
- body farm
- briansprediction
- Casey Anthony
- caylee anthony
- cindy anthony
- Cynthia Anthony
- David Lohr
- George Anthony
- Geraldo
- greta
- Jesse Grund
- Jesus Ortiz
- John Morgan
- Jose Baez
- larry garrison
- Lee Anthony
- leonard paddilla
- leonard padilla
- Lies
- Mark Nejame
- Nancy Grace Show
- Open Thread
- Police
- posts from comments
- Press Corps Media
- Press Releases
- protesters
- psychics
- Released Documents
- search
- searches
- The Today Show
- Tim Miller
- Tony Padilla
- Uncategorized
- Video
- War on Crime radio
- Zenaida Gonzales
- Zenaida Gonzalez
HII
OMG IM 1st
No I dont think they do
ARN!!! Where R u???
My gosh, they have enough evidence for sure. No body necessary.
I just think about it as if I were on the jury. What will the PA present:
friends who she’s lied to,
money stolen from most of them,
a decomp odor in the trunk,
a stain in the trunk,
Casey doesn’t report missing child for 31 days,
Casey lies to investigators,
Casey is nonchalant thru the investigation
Doesn’t give any credible information,
unforturnately no body,
Forensics are not conclusive
*please feel free to add to this
Casey’s actions during the first 31 days.
Arguments from defense:
This is the uncertainity that they will plant in the jurors minds.
Casey perceived by many as a good mother
Casey lucked out with the name of Zenaida Gonzalez at the Sawgrass apts. on June 17th
The trip to Puerto Rico will play a part in the defense
Expert (well-known) witnesses will argue the fact that the forensic are inconclusive
They will play on the fact that no body has been found despite the fact that there were thorough and done by some of the best searchers in the country.
They will add a few pictures and sitings of a possible Caylee into the mix.
*please feel free to add to this list
Indy Deb,
The pictures may be what will hurt her case the most.
I agree.
But I’ve wondered if Casey was acting the way she did was because she knew where Caylee was and didn’t feel the need to worry. Kind of solidifying the claim she was with “a babysitter”.
*Absolutely* Enough evidence.
I did watch Crime stories earlier (Woodchipper murder) and could not believe that the first trial was a mistrial. One of the experts was Dr. Lee. He testified for the prosecution though, not the defense. The evidence seemed completely overwhelming but there was one lone juror. The second trial resulted in a murder one conviction. Ironically it was the first case in the US to get a ‘no body’ conviction.
Dee~She really can’t go with the fact that she was shopping and partying it up for 31 days because she knew Caylee was with the babysitter. She’s already said that (first) she dropped her off with ZG at Sawgrass and when she went back for her, they were nowhere to be found and all numbers were disconnected and then (second) ZG and her sister took Caylee from her at JB Park. In either situation she should have called LE or been in some state of panic.
I think Casey lied about the 31 days because it doesn’t make sense. If on July 15th, she claims it was 31 days since she last saw Caylee would make Caylee missing NOT on June 17th, but Saturday, June 14th and we all know that isn’t correct. There a big lie in here somewhere and I don’t get it. I think others know the truth and Casey messed up with the date.
Curious Dee,
The recently released interviews with C and G certainly won’t help her if they can be played in court or if C and G are on the stand and asked about them. Especially Georges. It’s not good PR when your parents, who love you, say these things about you.
I think that CA’s delusional self is not helping Casey. I think that is the reason for no real rush on a gag order. The prosecution can see that she is doing more harm than good, but Baez thinks she’s providing “resonable doubt”.
Its not good at all for Casey. She’s done everything possible to make herself look guilty. From dancing at nightclubs, to borrowing shovels, to stealing gas cans.
It sounds like a person who wants to get caught.
The tattoo, its all so obvious, so I just want to know why she continues lying, it doesn’t make any sense.
Why doesn’t she just come up with a sad sob story claim it was an accident due to her neglect. That would be the best outcome for her. Unless the body found would tell a very gruesome tale. ???
Fun and my score is 56. can I have another person beat me? (not literally)
pictogame.com/game.php?game=qGZQkiMICf28&from_gc=1
We’ve only seen “preliminary” forensic reports and that’s damaging enough. I’m convinced the stain is going to be some very strong scientific evidence. Add that to all the circumstantial evidece, and it’s Murder One for sure. I also see that based on Jose Baez’s witness list, the only defense he has is to put doubt out there on the scientific evidence. He has no witnesses to speak on Casey’s behalf. She’s toast.
Nap time~chat with you all later.
Why would Dr. Lee put his good name on the line for a defense team that seems to have everything stacked against them? Isn’t it his perogative to testify for the defense or prosecution or is he an impartial forensics expert? Since he’s on the defense witness list I would think he’s for hire by the defense.
Its just TOO obvious. I guess I’m thinking as a sane reasonable person. The jury will have to think like Casey and realize all of her actions were that of an unstable, habitual liar, narcisstic- self serving individual who only cared about herself.
If PA gets that point across, she’ll get the DP. If not,
she may be found not guilty of murder. Murder is the key word and without all of the elements its going to be hard to prove IMO.
SheilaB raises a good point. Casey does not have one witness on her side that can lend her any credibility of being a decent human being. I mean, I’m sure Baez will bring out statements on the cross examinations that may shed her in a more “human” light, but I think it speaks volumes that she’s got no one to vouch for her character from the get go.
Just my opinion but I certainly think there’s more than enough evidence. Including tstatements from X-friends, parents, the forensics, dogs, the car the maggots. The whole picture is enough for a conviction They don’t need a body although it might help. I’m sure they also have some stuff we havent seen.
Cant imagine that girl going home ever. Bet the parents don’t think so either, and at least in jail Cindy is in complete control and knows pretty much where her daughter is and what she’s doing. Pretty sure knowing what she’s capable of she really doesn’t want her home.
Hi everyone!!
I feel to there is enough evidence to have her go away for a very long time. I know there is no body YET, but with all the strikes she has against her there will be no doubt that the jury finds her GUILTY of murder. Her father on the stand will be enough…I feel for them having to go threw this. No one wants to turn on their own child but the truth is the truth
I thought that this case would be lengthy when it went to trial, but looking at the defense list tells me that it may not be that lengthy after all.
Casey spent 6 hours a day, 5 days a week for about 2 months with Baez, and all he came up with is a few witnesses. What was really going on?
Zak,
Isn’t it funny that all the defense witnesses are paid witnesses and most of the prosecution witnesses are gonna come for free. What does that say
my only concern is that the jury may say there is no evidence that she murdered. Granted they have all the evidence that points to a dead body but will they be able to say murder? I would say yes due to the not wanting to say where she is, the lies, etc but unfortunately not every jury feels and or thinks the way we do.
Hellooo where are almy blogging buddies ?
who makes up those games Dee? I don’t remember any games like this about the other women that killed their children then again I didn’t pay much attention to those cases just this one
Zak, on November 22nd, 2008 at 4:12 pm Said:
Casey spent 6 hours a day, 5 days a week for about 2 months with Baez, and all he came up with is a few witnesses. What was really going on?
Zak do you really want an answer to that ??
Dont forget according to Biaez Casey was going to represent herself in court, remeber that one ? That was just an excuse so she could hang at his office and get away from her parents house.
OMG #1, I had forgotten about Casey the Lawyer
Possible Caylee Sighting
A photo of a girl involved in a possible Caylee sighting at an Orlando mall was released on Friday by a group searching for the missing girl.
D & A Investigations, an agency working with the Anthony family in the search for Caylee, obtained the photo, which was taken by a patron at the Florida Mall on Oct. 16.
The person who took the picture has declined to comment, Dominic Casey with D & A Investigations said. Earlier on Friday, Casey refused to identify the mall, citing an ongoing investigation.
When asked for specifics about the photo, Casey told Local 6 News reporter, “You’re not law enforcement.”
The photo has been provided to the Orange County Sheriff’s Office and the FBI, according to a news release. Investigators with the Orange County Sheriff’s Office have not commented on the photo, but the agency has said that it believes Caylee is dead.
HAS ANYONE SEEN THIS SPIN ON THE PHOTO ? OH PLEASE ENOUGH ALREADY !
Hey ! BJ did you read the new spin on the “photo” ? Boy these people are something arent they ?
And Dominck Casey needs to be careful because hell be next to be driven crazy by the Anthonys.( How fitting his last name is.)
If they are looking for Caylee lookalikes I could go to the mall right now and find about 50 of them in about 5 minutes.
Is the media short on news or what?
Your right! ENOUGH ALREADY
am i alone ? where is everyone ?
And who is this Dominck Casey guy? another player in this soap opera i quess hes there PI guy ? Hes the one that went to the mall and took a photo of any child that looks like caylle, very sick isnt it ? Ide like to see if Biaez trys to get this pic in trial. Hes been very quiet hasnt he ?
Hello Laura – just checking in to see what’s new — we are getting 2 feet of snow!
#1———everyone is out Christmas shopping for you and me! It’s a wonderful thing!
I just missed you in the Backroom, #1! Sorry!
Hey, where is the *spin* on photo?? Guess I’ll ck the news.
Hi Elisa, I saw you are from Buffalo? That’s where I live!!
What is the spin?
Caryn — I’m in PA just across the state line but we get Buffalo weather. I’m originally from Buffalo — and have to go there for work on Monday — what’s it like?
Casey Anthony’s Private Investigator Speaks
Monday, November 10, 2008
The private investigator working with the Anthonys to locate Caylee Marie believes Casey Anthony is a “loving and protective mother.”
Caylee anthony
Over the weekend, Equusearch spearheaded a massive effort in the Orlando, Florida area to locate the remains of missing toddler Caylee Marie Anthony. Over a thousand volunteers combed the terrain for two days — but found no signs of the child.
There is one man who is not in the least surprised by the outcome.
Dominic Casey, head of D & A Investigations, Inc., the agency working with the Anthony family to find Casey Anthony’s missing daughter, spoke exclusively with momlogic. And he vehemently believes the three-year-old is alive.
“You can call me crazy,” says Dominic, who has been a private investigator for 20 years. “Everyone is calling me crazy. I get death threats on a daily basis.”
With all the evidence mounting against Caylee’s mother Casey, it seems like a long shot the little girl will ever come home. From the mysterious “nanny” Casey claimed was watching after Caylee, to her chloroform recipe search, the partying and — most of all — Casey’s father George’s revelation that he noticed the “familiar” stench of death in the trunk of Casey’s car.
casey_anthony_more_photos.jpg
Caylee and Casey Anthony Gallery
Whatever George Anthony smelled, Dominic is convinced it was not Caylee Marie.”There is no indication in any of the forensic reports,” insists Dominic, “that say that the decomposition was of a human nature. They are all inconclusive.”
Dominic Casey says he is still actively searching for clues, just has he has been since days after Caylee’s disappearance — all pro bono. “We offered our services to the Anthonys and since then we have not taken one cent from them. It’s not about the money. One’s ability to pay should not deny the right to available resources, especially in the case of missing child.”
In addition to his ongoing investigation, Dominic speaks with the Anthonys on a daily basis. “George and Cindy are good people living a nightmare.” And he stresses at no time have the Anthonys ever doubted the innocence of their daughter. “Absolutely not. Never. They completely support Casey.” But, he adds, “I would never give them false hope.” Dominic has also spoken many times with Casey, meeting with her in Orange County Jail early as August. “She is absolutely distraught,” says Dominic when asked about her demeanor on these visits, “I cannot imagine what that girl is going through.”
Ultimately, Dominic is sick of the sensationalism that surrounds this case. “Please, stop the negativity,” he pleads. In his opinion, one detail that keeps feeding the media frenzy is law enforcement’s release of nearly 1000 tips from psychics to the public — not legitimate Caylee sightings. “The Sheriff’s department claims they are withholding the tips because they are currently investigating them. But that’s impossible,” Dominic says, adding “There are in excess of 5,000 tips. By withholding the tips of people who say they saw Caylee Marie, it just fuels the public opinion that Caylee Marie is no longer with us. And that is untrue.”
For some, Dominic realizes it’s difficult to understand how he or, for that matter the Anthonys, can have hope for Caylee Marie’s safe return. Dominic puts the question directly to parents. “What if your child disappeared and there was no conclusive evidence that the child was dead, would you give up the search?”
Another search begins today, this one led by Leonard Padilla, the bounty hunter who helped post Casey Anthony’s bail. Padilla is heading up a dive team searching a river in the Orlando area. As with the Equusearch effort, Dominic says he would be absolutely devastated if Caylee’s remains were found. “I would fall apart. I would not believe the remains were of Caylee Marie. Not for one minute would I believe Casey would do that to her child. I’ve spent many hours with her and she is a loving and protective mother.”
WOW 2 feet of snow ! im sooo jealous !!
No snow at all, it was actually sunny today, but only mid 30’s. Rochester got hit pretty good though!
Like we said before and before that and before that too:
Everytime something damaging comes out that says Caysee murdered Caylee, there is a new sighting…..
This is not helping the defense, it is to the point where people are FED UP – no more!!!
caryn, on November 22nd, 2008 at 4:45 pm Said:
Hi Elisa, I saw you are from Buffalo? That’s where I live!!
==========
My son in law is from Buffalo (Lockport)
BJ i missed that article along the way thanks for posting it, so casey will talk to a PI guy and give him info but not LE ? ok I think this guy is feeding the Anthonys more BS! Trying to make a name for himself and put on a resume that he worked on this case.
Do I think they will find her guilty? Yes. Thankfully
Do I think she will get death penalty? No. Perhaps life in prison because LE even said (a few weeks ago) with the evidence they have now, they dont think they have enough for death penalty. So if LE said it themselves with their very own lips, then I have no reason to disbelieve them. They don’t lie like Casey
I know Lockport very well, BJ.
One of my girlfriends in college used to work in as a bartender out there.
My husband and I met at the Festival of Lights in Niagara Falls — he’s from PA — I miss Buffalo tho –
Caryn — are you in the City or one of the suburbs?
Elisa, technically the city; I’m in North Buffalo off Hertel Ave where they have the Italian Festival every year.
I have to correct myself:
I have previously insisted that noone actually stated they saw maggots. The towyard guy referenced maggots, but never actually said he saw maggots and other than Cindy’s ranting, there was nothing else…….until George’s FBI interview was released………ok now I feel better.
I thought the spin was when local 6 asked the PI guy for specifics on the photo, he said “Your Not Law Enforcement” Is he serious ?
Ahem! Elisa and I are still looking ffor the photo *spin*
~~~~#1Laura, on November 22nd, 2008 at 4:35 pm Said:
Hey ! BJ did you read the new spin on the “photo” ? Boy these people are something arent they ?
OH caryn ans Elisa you all get my snow up there,
Im in south jersey and we get nada every year.
#1,
Cindy says that Casey can’t be honest with LE because she is afraid that Caylee will be harmed if LE goes busting in to the place where she is. And also that Casey is telling Cindy where Caylee is but not the exact location because of the threat of harm to Caylee. Then, if that is such a concern why is anyone searching……..Cindy keeps saying SEARCH, SEARCH, SEARCH.
OR>>>>>>>maybe Caylee will only be harmed if LE find her but not if Cindy’s PI finds her.
I don’t even understand what I wrote……I’m soooo confused with the spin!
#1Laura, on November 22nd, 2008 at 4:34 pm Said:
Possible Caylee Sighting
A photo of a girl involved in a possible Caylee sighting at an Orlando mall was released on Friday by a group searching for the missing girl.
D & A Investigations, an agency working with the Anthony family in the search for Caylee, obtained the photo, which was taken by a patron at the Florida Mall on Oct. 16.
The person who took the picture has declined to comment, Dominic Casey with D & A Investigations said. Earlier on Friday, Casey refused to identify the mall, citing an ongoing investigation.
When asked for specifics about the photo, Casey told Local 6 News reporter, “You’re not law enforcement.”
The photo has been provided to the Orange County Sheriff’s Office and the FBI, according to a news release. Investigators with the Orange County Sheriff’s Office have not commented on the photo, but the agency has said that it believes Caylee is dead.
HAS ANYONE SEEN THIS SPIN ON THE PHOTO ? OH PLEASE ENOUGH ALREADY !
I found this on local 6 it was recently posted.
Caryn – I lived on Ashland near West Ferry — loved the Italian Festival –
#1 – My daughter went to college in Philadelphia and it hardly snowed — she missed it –
I love it in the Elmwood village down there, Elisa- my aunt and uncle live down on Richmond near W Ferry.
#1 Laura, are they talking about that same photo that was released with the two girls who look like they could be sisters?
You all can have Indiana and all it has to offer…………..It’s either too hot, too cold or it’s raining!
Elisa, on November 22nd, 2008 at 4:51 pm Said:
My husband and I met at the Festival of Lights in Niagara Falls — he’s from PA — I miss Buffalo tho
===============
Elisa, what is your husbands name if that’s not too personal.. I know of a Elisa from the Buffalo area wit a connection to PA
Well Dominck Casey is the only person the Anthonys have left, it seems LE has had enough of them, Negime has had enough of them, Todd Black is gone.
Has anyone noticed the Bozo team is getting slimer and slimer by the day ?
Caryn — when I get back, I always go to Chef’s
Now — where is the spin? Local 6 Orlando?
BJ – does she have a 26 year old daughter?
Yes cayn they are. I quess local 6 TRIED to ask the PI guy some info on it and that was his response. what a jack-a–
No, she is in her 30’s and has a young son but is from the Buffalo area and now in PA
Thanks
1Laura, on November 22nd, 2008 at 4:53 pm Said:
I thought the spin was when local 6 asked the PI guy for specifics on the photo, he said “Your Not Law Enforcement” Is he serious ?
BJ – That’s interesting because someone I worked with in Buffalo married someone from the same town my husband was from – what a small world!
GET OUT! Mr. Casey while you still can !! The Anthonys will bring you down like they have to everyone else who doesnt agree with them ! hes all they have left, I wonder where all this evidence he has found is at ?
I guess the PI might as well talk to the media, I thought LE was no longer searching for a live Caylee, so they won’t want to talk to him, right? Neither of those two girls is Caylee anyhow.
Caryn the way I took Mr. Caeys reply was he seemed not to wanna answer local 6, and a littile sarcastic.
I couldn’t even finish the Cindy videos — it was just too pathetic listening to her grasping for every “hint” as she called it — now the PI is on board with their way of thinking. So sad — you can’t delay the inevitable.
Elisa,
25 years ago I met someone in the unemployement line after moving back to OR and told him that my husband had worked far a specific company in CA and had been layed off. He said he knew someone from that company that had moved to OR, too. I said I didn’t know anyone else had moved to OR after the layoff from the company.
Then I mentioned my brothers name that still lived in CA and he said WAIT, what is his last name. I told him and he asked me if I knew a Brad —— and I said yes. It turns out that the man was my brothers roommates father and he and my husband were both staying with my brother and the roommate at the same time in CA.
My husband had been called back to work for a short time and this guy was in CA looking for a job.
It’s a SMALL WORLD
OMG caryn I couldnt either listening to CA was complete HELL! I had to stop, all she wanted to do was have her littile paper out with all her notes and not listen to a word the FBI was saying to her, I felt bad for them 2 guys that had to listen to her “spin” that hole time !
GA a did feel a bit bad for, and I never new how niave he really was I quess living with CA for all these years the man has lost his marbles.
#1,
They looked so bored!
BJ — that’s so neat! You just never know, do you?
I didn’t think Cindy was ever going to take a breath — what I thought was interesting was that she kept shuffling papers while she spoke — not always looking directly at the FBI agents –
Laura- I think you were commenting on Elisa’s comment about the Cindy vids, but I did comment earlier today that at first I wanted to jump off my balcony, and then I got so tired listening to Cindy by the end of the third tape that I literally fell asleep sitting in front of my laptop last night after NG! I woke up hours later and went to bed.
Okay – I just found the video about the PI and the sighting — this is just insane! If you truly want to find a child, wouldn’t you put out everything you could? Why hide it?
I laughed last night and said I bet the FBI agent is married and has daughters — halfway through he says he is married and has two daughters — anyone who has raised daughters know how they can go on and on — a developed patience
What are the legal repercussions for putting a picture of a child all over the media without parental consent? Anyone know? I would hate to think that just anyone could snap a picture of a family member and do what they want with the picture in the media? Even in the schools you have to give consent to internet usage and picture taking for internet and/or media purposes. I’m sure the parents are outraged. I would love to see them act on that.
Got a real problem here. There are people on this blog peeing their pants, threatening to shoot themselves and wanting to jump off balconies
You guys HAVE got to get a grip
BJ – it’s called total frustration
Oh yes caryn sorry i wrote the wrong name
well the CA interviews were insane, and I just dont understand that women. My god all she did was blame blame blame everyne but casey, she even tried to blame the orlando LE to the FBI, i quess to see what they would say but the FBI guys werent having it.
Well she cant say they didnt let her talk !
BJ and we dont even live with CA !!
POOR GEROGE!!
Tracy—-you are so right about the parental consent…I hope the parents of this child in the picture go after Cindy….
CAn you imagine wht the agents said when CA left and they closed the door? Oh, to be a fly on the wall
Hahahaha!!!
THANK THE LORD FOR SMALL FAVORS, #1
It’s amazing Casey didn’t crack long before this.
Did they explain Lee’s absence on NG last night? I was in and out of the show — might have missed it -
Hi Jasonsmom- how are you? Aside from you posting new threads (thank you), I have not seen you around so much.
Elisa, I believe one of his parents said he’s been working, and one said he’s been traveling. Maybe he’s traveling for work?
I want to be a fly on the wall at C’s and G’s when they are alone. I wonder if she keeps saying, “It was the Pizza, wasn’t it, George” and then George says, “Yes, it was the Pizza”.
That might be a good title for Cindy’s book……”It Was The Pizza”
Elisa,” it seems Lee is very busy at work,” hmmmm it seems more to me like hes in hiding !
He seemed to disappear suddenly and hasn’t been seen since –
I hope LE confiscated Lee’s passport.
Who keeps a pizza in their trunk anyway? Strange place to store it –
caryn—was doing good till i listened to Cindy in the land of Oz….I would rather read an interview with her than have to listen to it….
Someone mentioned on another thread that perhaps Lee is working behind the scenes with LE — wouldn’t that be interesting?
caryn—I’m really doing great…did you listen to George
I know this is off topic, but I have an order for Penuche(?) fudge and never made it before — has anyone had it and is it good?
Ok dumb question..but then again somebody told me no question is dumb. Is first degree murder automatically the death penalty.
Elise I think it is like a brown sugar fudge.
I never met a fudge I didn’t like.
Jeanne — doesn’t it depend on whether it is a death penalty state?
Jeanne — good – come on over and I’ll put the coffee on. I made 96 pounds of it today
Jeanne—I don’t think so..
Jasosnsmom- I listened to George first. He always seems pretty forthcoming in LE interviews. At least it’s evident that he’s doing his best to be honest, although one can tell how difficult it is for him to say some of the things he’s saying.
By the way I am making fudge tonight to take to my sons house for Thanksgiving. It is a recipe I perfected and it is getting rave reviews. Finally.
My friend makes the absolute best fudge. The kind with sugar, milk and cocoa. Hers always comes out…perfect.
Sorry folks but she said fudge and…I lost my mind.
Hi jasonsmom! Great job on the threads by the way! What’s with the ‘w’? Typo? I almost didn’t recognize you if not for caryn. Well, great to *see* you.
Jeanne—it can be death or life in prison
Brown Sugar Fudge – Penuche
I just looked up a recipe for it and it looks delicious but I have never tasted it.
Tracy—Good question about that W–I think yourturn re-named me…he is doing work on the blog….
Caryn – George interviews well, but didn’t it seem like he was trying too hard to be “friends” with them — and what about, as he called it, his bad financial decisions — seems there is another side to George that wasn’t there before
No that I know of 1st degree murder doesnt always mean the DP, but it can be life in prsion with out parole, while 2nd degree could be life in prison with parole. Manslaughter would be what Biaez would want, that could be 10-15 with parole also.
Elisa, on November 22nd, 2008 at 5:35 pm Said:
Jeanne — good – come on over and I’ll put the coffee on. I made 96 pounds of it today
—————————
Have Mercy….
Jasonsmom- and I’m glad that you are doing great
Sometimes I get so wrapped up in this that I forget my manners… sorry!
Elisa—wow fudge..Yummmy
Sorry – guess my point was that maybe Cindy had to be a control freak between George and Casey creating financial chaos –
WJasonsmom
Penuche Sugar Fudge
Submitted by: Sara
This chocolate-free fudge with nuts is made with brown suga… MORE
JasonsMom- and I’m craving real food now – I always thought having a candy business would be every woman’s dream, but I’d give anything for a great pizza or sub right now –oooooh — or Buffalo Wings-
Hello, I’m back. Had to do some normal life things..lol
And went back to listen to some interviews.
I wonder what day the PA is going to say Caylee died.
Go back and listen to Jesse’s interview where he is adamant about the date he heard Caylee in the background. I know he has recanted that statement, but if you listen to the tape, its hard to believe that he was mistaken. I don’t thnk he’s lying. Everyone has pointed out he’s passed the polygraph. Huh? I’d like to know what questions were asked. Another thing I never really caught onto till now is his continuing relationship with Casey all along. How could he still be a friend to her after all she has done to him? She even brought Tony L to a party held at his apt. He said he left for a little while, which makes me think…he’s wasn’t too happy about Tony being there. To me Casey has antagonized Jesse for a long time. So now I wonder if he was dating anyone when all this was going on? And my final question is: When he found out that Caylee wasn’t his, wouldn’t he ask her,” ok Casey, I’m not the real father so who in the heck is?? Thats what I think a normal person would want to know. Not that it matters who’s the father, but why is it such a big secret?
caryn—no problem on my end..this is a crazy case and it is so easy to get wrapped up in…
Yeah, Elaine. I was pretty surprised to hear that he fell for an internet scam. But then again, when one has trained himself to live with the caliber of lies Casey was slinging, it might make a person silly naive in regards to most things.
Elisa—that is funny….did you make enough for your order?? hope so..
Curious — that’s a good thought — I always looked at Jesse as a stable influence on Casey — but how could he put up with all of this?
Although George said Jesse truly loved Caylee as though she was his – isn’t that sad that Casey probably played off those feelings?
JasonsMom – I made every kind of fudge imaginable and have only a couple left to go — never knew there were so many!
Cindy Anthony is a desperate woman. She sits there for 4 hours and talks NONSTOP trying to weave a story justifying her daughter’s lies. At the end of it all, she has no answers, no conclusions that make sense, but she can’t stop because she can’t allow herself to believe her daughter could have killed her grandchild. It is painful to watch. Casey has been horrendously CRUEL in doing this to her own mother. All i can say again is it is PAINFUL to watch. I’m sick to my stomach.
Not that I am opposed to the death penalty but at this point I think it lets Casey off too easy. I think I would prefer she just rot for the rest of her life behind bars. I think it would be much more tormenting for her.
Elisa—I agree about Jesse….I really think he is a good guy…George attitude towards him I could not figure out…I think he was jealous of Jesse..since Jesse stood up to Cindy..something that George can’t do…
Caryn…lol so I am not the only one that CA put to sleep, hey…maybe we should make money off of them too, and market them as “Sleeping Aid Tapes”….sorry Santa….like I said in my letter to you I really am trying to be better.
Well I just about flipped my cap when I heard George say…he fell for the old Nigerian Swindle…C;mon George…wake up.. Smell the coffee boiling. This man was a detective, homocide for heavens sake. He ran an auto business. No wonder Casey ran amuck.
No wonder Cindy put the house in her name. And speaking of muffin head did I hear George say Cindy to that day thought he lost the money gambling? WAKE UP CINDY. ITS THE END OF THE WORLD CINDY.
What is with these people.
I guess I have never lived with thiefs, gamblers, liars and baby killers.
Amazing simply amazing.
Speaking of which. I watched seven tapes of George interviews yesterday. I plan on starting the Cindy mess this evening. Any suprises???
Elisa—all I can say is wow….that is a lot of fudge
Jasonsmom….why that name change to wjasonsmom?? Just curious.
Jesse is a “rescuer”. He is there to help Casey, and Casey leans on him for advice and help. He couldn’t stay in LE with that type of personality.
or did I miss something and it has always been wjason???
Oh jeanne all i can say is its the same old same old from CA ! we have heard it all the past 4 months, and seing the tapes for me just reinstiled the fact she is a NUT CASE !
Jeanne1807- for Cindy’s interview, you might want to get a cup of hot tea or cocoa to calm you during your first impression, and then make sure to have your sleeping cap on. She will weave some tales that will bring you to exhaustion. Listen to Jadan and I… we both fell asleep!
hey new yorkers, i’m from syracuse
Jeanne1807
prepare to be mentally frazzled. You will feel as crazy as Cindy as by the time you finish all 4 tapes. George was easy to sit through and watch. I had to keep taking breaks on Cindy’s. She talks nonstop and nothing she says makes any sense. I am impressed with the FBI’s patience.
Jeanne—you heard right….that I could not figure out…He would go down for the gambling and not the other?? Did that make sense?
jasonsmom i noticed when you have been putting up threads the past few times it always say wjasonsmom, when yourturn went on his cruise the w started, no biggie we all know its you
Hey Mia- I didn’t know you were in Syracuse… it’ll be a race to see who gets the most snow this winter!
Jaden—Yourturn re-named me…He is working on the blog and some how I am now Wjasonsmom…
Hey jadan !
how r u feeling today ?
Curious Dee I am sure Jesse asked Casey and I am sure she told him the truth right off.
But my comment were still under jasonsmom…O well it’s still me…
I didn’t doubt it either Laura, just curious…since it was something I had never noticed….slow on the uptake here. BTW, hi all
Mia—Hi
Jadan—I am slow on the uptake too…
After listening to the George and Cindy show..nobody will ever be the same. We are changed people.
Curious Dee,
I do think it matters who Caylee’s father is. Maybe not so much who he is but definately who he isn’t. Some of the rumors need to be halted and only by *proof* will they be. Should some of the rumors be true then it will provide an opportunity for the prosecution to show just how much more *twisted* this family is and allow for them to create new theories. I’m not in the opinion of some of the rumors and I’m surprised that they didn’t, through evidence, show otherwise a long time ago. I do think that needs to be done quickly. Rule out any and all fathers possible.
Thanks for understanding, I was just asking since I never noticed it before….
Laura I am okay, tired, for no reason…after all I slept through CA;s tapes, and then all night. Alot of pain today. My body hates the cold.
Well I am off to listen to Cindy for a while, make some fudge and then read the Hawkins emails.
My life sucks.
Jeanne —but you have us
Tracy I don’t think they will ever know that. There isn’t enough testing material in Florida for that one.
Jeannie make the fudge and read emails before…you will go to sleep.
wjasonsmom, on November 22nd, 2008 at 5:58 pm Said:
Jeanne —but you have us
—————–
I am even talking different. I don’t think I have ever used that word before..goodness gracious.
Thank you Wjasonsmom
Jadan..you are funny.
Okay – the penuche is done and it looks pretty interesting —
As for George and his bad financial decisions, if that was my husband I would tell him it was just plain stupid. One mistake maybe — but one after another (plus 2 years of unemployment)– and then Casey’s spending on top of it? I don’t feel sorry for Cindy, but I’m surprised she didn’t work 2 jobs to pay for all of this
Elisa…what is penuche???
Elisa,
If what Jesse said was true, and I do believe it, then where was Caylee between June 16th and June 24th.
And why would Casey be going thru all of the motions of borrowing a shovel, stealing gas cans, etc. on the 18th, 19th, 22nd of June. And don’t forget, Casey’s car was at the impound from June 30th till July 15th. (someone correct me if my dates are wrong, cuz this is where I get confused)
So much has happened since May 14th. And it looks like Tony L’s appearance into the group changed everything. Its seems since Tony arrived in the picture, Ricardo, Jesse, Tony R and who knows who else, where ditched. I see some jealousy here. Even on Amy’s part where she describes how sickening and giddy Casey got when she talked to Tony L. I think Baez is going to touch on that issue and see where it leads.
I could only listen to part 1 of Cindy’s — it was soooo bad -
Curious — I think Jesse would have been a stablizing factor in Casey’s life –
When Tony appeared, she definitely changed — was she trying to impress him and his friends? Was there more drug activity than anyone knows? Something is just not right there –
What are the odds that GA really lost the money gambling and he lied to the FBI? Why would anyone admit to such a rediculous scam? I would have stuck with the gambling problem for sure.
Those emails from Mark Hawkins were from July, 2007. I thought there were more current ones.
So I have to ask..from the set we read, did he come home, did they hook up.
Does anybody know if there are more?
Elisa,
I stopped after part 1 and thought I wouldn’t be able to finish them, but took a break and then went back to it. The whole thing is truly exhausting. The most interesting I believe is Part 4 where she gets into specifics about the car and 911 calls. She’s also running out of steam after having talked nonstop for hours, and definitely is seeming less sure of herself.
It really is painful to see how desperate Cindy is…..
Tracy,
George said that he had all the paperwork involved in the scam. I think he’s smarter than his daughter as far as thinking he could lie to LE and get away with it. He’s got to know they could check it out.
hi jasonsmom
elaine – oh how i wish i had a tiny piece of that fudge! Ok.. i can’ lie. i really want a big ‘ole hunk.
Elisa the other day before all the tapes broke I wrote at length about how the Anthonys could afford the life style they were living. Cindy works as a nurse and makes pretty good money but she is lead dog. George works security which in our area is minimum wage and of course Casey didn’t work at all. So they had four people living the high life. They supported four very nice autos. I don’t know about all of you but supporting one vehicle is expensive. They had four. Two suv’s, Cindys green truck and Caseys auto.
The Anthonys were bleeding money.
BJ-Thanks! That’s what I get for not listening to the tapes. I agree as well. He’s not a very smart man but I do think smart enough to not tell such a blatant lie to the FBI.
jadan, i just sent u pics of my daughter, let me know if u got them thanks
SheilaB — maybe I’ll go back when I done here and give it another try — I did try to listen to Cindy after all of George’s –
mia so do I…it is torture..so close yet so far away. lol
Jeanne — I thought the same thing — plus neither George nor Cindy are working now, correct? Who is paying the bills?
George is working security..he said that somewhere. He works afternoons or nights. Cindys employer is paying her while she is off work. Actually he might be paying her to stay home..lol
They are probably a lot better off because they don’t have Casey stealing every dime they manage to have.
Elisa
I have to admit I did abslutely NOTHING yesterday but listen to these tapes – lol, by 10:00 last night I was exhausted. I got up this morning, with a nice hot latte and finished the final Cindy tape. Maybe that’s why I felt that one was the most interesting, I was refreshed……don’t know,let me know your thoughts after you sit through it
Tracy, I’m in total agreement with you. Caylee’s father is important to the case and can easily be proven because when Jesse took the paternity test, Caylee’s true DNA was stored with the laboratory. So it will be very easy to prove.
Also, about GA’s gambling issue, I just wonder if he’s trying to cover up a big purchase or lump sum of money that will show up on their banking accts. I think I heard CA wasn’t being compliant with LE about relinquishing bank statements and credit card info.
GA, has his excuse in place.
I mean Nigerian Pyramid Scam…lol, thats a good one.
As if??
Elisa some time I would love to hear about your business in the backroom. I would be glad to share my candy recipes with you.
sheila, what flavor latte? mmmmmm.
Mia always vanilla……..
Good evening all~
George would know better than to lie to FBI…lying to the FBI is a federal offense. Can anyone say Martha Stuart ?
oh heck, i’m bein’ moderated again?? for talkin’ about coffee?
Curious Dee I still can’t get over that “bombshell” George dropped.
People wonder why we are into this case like we are.
Let me see. This week..they released the tapes. George is into the Nigerian scam, The Anthonys attorney bailed on them..unheard of. The Anthonys scheduled a press conference to tell all..then cancelled the last day. Hummm help me what else happened. Something every day with that bunch.
Did anybody see the Nancy Grace last night. There was George and Cindy walking arm and arm with Dakota. And Lois. Dakota looked like she was taking them all to the promised land. I wonder when and how that all soured. Which I am sure it did.
Mia
Look at yourself, obsessing over lattes and fudge, maybe you need the moderation in your life
I stand by my theory that Casey took on characteristics of those she killed.
She took on the following from Nicole Ganguzza- organized, child advocate, running/jogging, UCF student, physical characteristics- hair color…
Caylee – dyed her hair dark brown, GIDDY, want to sleep in parents’ room with teddy….
Jennifer Kesse- dyed her hair blond…
Casey is crazy – but sly as a fox. She planned and carried out her plans. The question is: who was next?
Mia..hello. How do you know you are being moderated???
Mia, we all have been moderated alot lately, we cant put links up right now either. I think its a glitch.
SheilaB, on November 22nd, 2008 at 6:22 pm Said:
Mia
Look at yourself, obsessing over lattes and fudge, maybe you need the moderation in your life
—————————–
Good one Sheila but to tell you the truth we are all obsessing about Elisas fudge.
SheilaB,
I understand exactly about listening to the tapes. It’s alot easier than trying to read transcipts. But for some reason I can’t get to the Cindy tapes. I’m avoiding them like the plague. She’s such a screw-up. She isn’t helping anyone, not Casey or LE. I don’t know what she has to say, but from what I’ve heard I haven’t missed much.
That’s another one who’s done a 180 degree turn. Before all of this, she didn’t have one thing good to say about her daughter, now all of a sudden Casey’s is super mom. But before she was trying to get custody of Caylee. This is just too weird.
howdy Laura !
Mia,
not me, I ate some peanut M&M’s when the fudge came up
Zak I truthfully think it was Cindy and George. She talked about getting the house and there might have been insurance. Most of the money was gone but I would love to know if there was any insurance money. I bet through Cindys work.
I think they were next.
Zak,
You have never changed on that theory and I have to say, I don’t doubt anything at this point.
LOL…I need a nap.
bbl
HI SWAY !! how r u tonight ?
Curious Dee — excellent thought about George and the money — plus I never thought about the DNA being stored from Jesse’s paternity test — Good thinking!
Jeanne – would love to talk in the backroom sometime — it’s only been a year since we opened but I can’t keep up – we’re so busy
Does everyone feel bad for Jesse Grund? He really wanted to be Caylee’s father and you have to wonder that if he had married Casey, maybe things would have taken a different path – at least for little Caylee.
Zak I don’t know..Casey a serial killer..thats a bit of a stretch for me.
Convince me…..
Curious Dee,
Cindy actually described Casey’s behaviour as a mother as “perfect”, she used that word with the FBI agent. It was well, again, PAINFUL. And she is not helping anyone. She’s desperate and IMO she is showing us by her own dysfunction why this whole tragedy was destined to happen to this family.
Jeanne1807
I agree with you 100%. I think GA knows this also, and in the back of his mind is testifying because he does not want to have to watch his back (or front) the rest of his life. I think he is done with all of the problems and money she has cost them. I wonder if there was a policy on Caylee………………….
I often think about Casey…sitting in jail now for what…30 plus days… eating crappy food and bored out of her mind.
I wonder what she does all day ? And does she think she will get away with all this ?
I also wonder how she can live with herself ..not only what she did to Caylee but what she is doing to her parents too ?
————————————-
I am well Laura…dreaming of Elisa’s fudge though …yum !
how about you ???
Hi, I’m new to posting, but i have been lurking for long time.
I think Caysee was blackmailing the babydaddy.
With great responsibility comes great consequence….
what ya think?
Hey y’all
Just got done watching George interviews. They were long! He knows what happened
So does Cindy
Elisa I have mixed thoughts about Jesse Grund. I often wonder why he want all the way and became a policeman and then..abruptly quit. That gives me a hummm.
I wonder why he put up with Casey and her lies..but explain that with “love is blind”.
What is he doing now?
Funny how George and Cindy paint him in a different light. She makes him out to be a huge man 6ft 3 ” and about 240obs. Terrible temper. Didn’t like him. Another hummm.
Another sad note from the Cindy interview was her telling the agent how Casey broke down when she was telling Lee that Caylee had been kidnapped. She made a big issue of how upset Casey was and she was crying. Any mother would be hysterical, beyond belief the SECOND their child was missing. NOT 31 days later. It was obvious Cindy was trying to show that Casey really was upset, because she obviously knows her behavior has not been normal
Shelley…yes they do.
pi hello and welcome.
Oh Boy, I don’t think George and Cindy like Jesse. But then again, they could be trying to put the blame on someone besides Caysee.
I don’t know what to think about Jesse myself…
I mean he seems like a good guy and all, but so did Ted Bundy
The penuch is really good — different than I thought — coffee’s on folks –
Casey probably considers herself lucky as this point – jail is much safer than being outside. I don’t think she has a conscience — look at all the things she’s done to her friends and just didn’t care. She doesn’t have any feelings –
sway said:
I also wonder how she can live with herself ..not only what she did to Caylee but what she is doing to her parents too ?
==========================
You are forgetting that Casey is the victim here. Sway, where have you been
Even when she was first arrested no one cared about her….only finding Caylee.
Can we all spell VICTIM
Elisa–I feel bad for the entire Grund family. His dad loved that baby too, so much. There’s no doubt in my mind that they both loved Caylee and paternity, once they were introduced, was no matter. I don’t think he was Casey ’stabilizer’, I think he was Casey’s doormat. She’s a user and abuser and when there was nothing left in it for her she dropped him in a hurry. I don’t think he was someone that Casey learned to count on, I think he was always available for her when no one else was. He allowed himself to be seduced and used because he loved her and Caylee and unfortunately none of that was reciprocated by Casey. She wasn’t smart enough to use him as a ’stabilizer’ or she would have been smart enough to never let go. He was the best thing that ever happened to her and she was too stupid and selfish to ever allow herself to see it.
Do you really think George and Cindy know what happened? I guess I am a bit naive.
Of course I still believe in santa and watch for him every Christmas Eve.
Hey Sway! Could you tell like I could by the way George was shaking his head. Especailly about the decomoposition. And just everything.
The FBI agent said to George “you know what your daughter’s been doing for the last 2 years right?” Did he mean prostitution? Porno? Drugs? All of the above?
I’m thinkin all of the above…
Good point Tracy and so very true, especially that she was too stupid and selfish to see what could have been the best thing for her and her little girl.
I sometimes wonder if Cindy’s opinion of Jesse was based on the fact that he did have moments of anger and frustration based on Casey’s actions while Cindy was in denial and enabled Casey — and perhaps he was thinking about the future for Caylee, who he thought for sometime was his daughter.
Zak, just wonderin…are you still thinking freezer or cooler? I’ve been meaning to ask you. I mean since no one has found poor little Caylee so far in the ground?
Elisa and BJ~ I agree about Casey having no conscience…but I still wonder what goes on in her head….I know I am a glutten for punishment !
—————————————
Howdy Shelly..all of the above…yep ! George has to walk on egg shells with Cindy but they both KNOW and have to keep up the pretense for media and Casey defense.
Shelly I wanted to know more about that too. I also was curious about the pictures they said were on the computer. I didn’t find the ones I saw..that bad. I would like to see the ones they are talking about. I wonder if it was porno pictures?
I think there is still a lot we don’t know. Maybe its better we just get this..drip by painful drip.
please someone here have the new link to murts site if o please give it to me he moved rooms again today and cant find him ty
Did you see Jesse’s father’s appearance where he broke down when the subject of Caylee’s death was mentioned? It was soooo sad –
What I found interesting was that G & C painted Jesse as jealous and almost stalking Casey — where SHE called him the day her car ran out of gas when it was left to be towed — Who calls their stalker?
Yes Jeanne, these drips are painful, I’m still hungover from yesterday’s tapes
Could Caylee be in some rented storage unit somewhere.
It baffles everybody..where is she.
Too many comments for me to go through them all.
Somebody mentioned the defense would used the Puerto Rico trip as part of the defense strategy. Go ahead, try it! It will come back to bite them in the butt!
Casey planned the trip, made all the arrangement, and then could not go because her mom would not watch Caylee.
Sway – I don’t think Casey knows what goes on in her head —
sorry ivana…don’t have it..
Shelley
Yes cooler or freezer. I think she had access to a freezer somewhere, but not for a long period of time. Then, she had to empty the freezer so she either put the frozen food on top or she put the body parts in the packages to disguise it.
Ok I am off to make my fudge, I have read the Hawkins emails..not much there. Just a young man who needs to read more so he can spell better and a girl who is stringing him alone for..whatever.
Then I am taking Cindy and her tapes on.
I hope you hear from me again. I think I will keep my eye on the LE and watch his body language.
Do you believe Casey had help? She’s pretty petite – although Caylee wasn’t very big –
Jeanne1807: There was a guy on Brians predictions that had a link to the Fusion “escort servie” site, and pron site. But he said he suspected it would be taken down due to all of the attention. This was a long time ago, like maybe 2 months or something. The pictures were there then. I didn’t go, as I am a woman, so I don’t go to guy pron sites. LOL
I figure all that has everything to do with everything and I fiugre by the time all the evidence comes out, it’s gonna be an ugly picture. You know it can’t be good since little Caylee is gone…
Elisa,
I personally don’t believe Casey had any help. She did this all by herself and IMO she will take this with her to the grave.
Shelley – that’s the first I heard of the Fusion escort service and porn site — but that would make sense — all of Casey’s partying and perhaps Tony’s involvement — hmmmmmmm
George said he didn’t want Casey in gen pop in prison and he knows she’s going away for a long time. And that was when they were talking about neglect, not murder.
Elisa~ I am going with a no on Casey having help.
I don’t think she trusted anyone enough….nor do I think she had this all planned out in advance.
I think George knows everything — I think Cindy is desperately denying it — she actually seemed a little manic in the 1st tape trying to convince the FBI that there were all these “hints” out there –
Sway — she trusted others as much as she herself could be trusted –
Elisa: I had figured: club, drugs. But I am just nieve and old enough to not think about porn and ‘escort service’ (and we all know what that means) until I read it. It is on one of the early postings on Brians predictions. Maybe a month or 2 into things.
If Caylee was buried, she could have been buried anywhere withing a three hour radius of Orlando. That’s alot of area to cover… and it isn’t just the pings.
I wonder if she and her friends had a bonfire and she innocently said, “Oh, I have a sack of trash in my car..”
A few of the gals at the daycare think that KC burned Caylee, therefore there would be NO evidence available. No body to be found.
IMHO, I think that the easiest way would have been for KC to dispose of Caylee in a commercial trash bin, and God (and KC) only know which one.
I really think KC is telling the truth that she doesn’t know where KC is. For this statement to be true, she had to have put KC in a dumpster, or had someone else dispose of the body.
It was funny when we were talking about the site on this site. I was like “watch all the guys are gonna go to briansprecictions now!” lol
Shelley – we must be the same age — I thought clubbing and drugs too — I guess I thought she was giving it away, not charging for it — LOL
Elisa: me too! I thought she was just a slut not a whore! LOL (sorry for the language)
If everyone disappears, we’ll know where to find them
Shelley — maybe she followed the advice — do what you are passionate about and the money will follow
FLmomof2: I have wondered about burning, dumpster, and I still wonder about a cooler or freezer in an abandoned house….Or a well, or drianage pipe. Or a suitcase
yep… and we all know what Casey’s trust is worth Elisa !
—————————————————–
FlMom~Whatever it was….I do believe Casey got rid of Caylee in the easiest, most convenient for Casey method.
Do you think she moved Caylee more than once? I’ve often wondered about that –
As for burning I know one expert said that the temperature would have to be so high that she probably couldn’t have done that — remember the Marine case? The body was intact –
Elisa: sure…now I’m gonna be famous! my pic is gonna be all over the internet! everyone can see me!
So yeah, how do you like it Casyee? You look great in your jail blues
Oh dear God — my husband called and said we have company coming — in a snowstorm — and I have 24 more pounds of fudge to make — On what planet does this make sense –
Sorry – but I have to go — maybe I should just feed them fudge and beer –
I think Caylee was moved at least once…That’s why I keep wonderin about the cooler or freezer. She used her moms suv one day. George followed her he said in the interview and he car was at the house.
I think Caylee was once at that house…whether the death took place there or she was placed there for a short period of time…either that or those dogs hit on the gas cans being placed on the grass in the yard..
Bye Elisa, come back
Where do you live?
I wish we had snow!
Shelly — blue is her color — remember the shirt she bought at Target with Amy’s money?
Okay — I have to go — wish I could stay — it was nice chatting with everyone –
It’s really encouraging to see that a lot of people think prosecution has enough for a 1st degree conviction. For some reason I am having a difficult time not wishing they had something more in addition to what is already there. Defense witness list seems to indicate that they are not even going to try insanity (normally the case when things look pretty bad), but will attack the DNA and lab results instead. Even if the experts fail to put any doubt into the jury’s mind by describing possible scientific errors, etc., how would that prove premeditation? And what is there to prove premeditation for the 1st degree? Stolen money, party photos, fights at home? None of that seems to really be all that relevant.
Also, are there any similar cases anyone heard about where there is a solid conviction with circumstantial evidence and no dead body? There was a link someone posted some time ago about “no body cases” – most of them had confessions, witnesses and other solid evidence. Also, if she is not convicted on the 1st degree, does anyone know if she still can be convicted of manslaughter in the same trial, or would that have to be a separate charge? And, if it has to be a separate charge, can she be charged with that or would double jeopardy apply?
Shelly — last answer, I promise – NW Pennsylvania — we actually got 2 feet today! It is absolutely beautiful (from in the inside out)
Oh by the way, Sway and Zak, I think it was y’all I was talking to one night bout the concrete under the playhouse…the slab. They did dig it up, thank God
bye Elisa…leave all your “mistakes” in the backroom please ! Good luck with the company !
Elisa: Beautiful! Enjoy!
Law Student: I am not a law student, but it’s just like you know she did it. Having nothing to do with the law, it’s just so obvious
premed = chloroform searches…how to make it..along with missing children searches on her computer.
Especially since a significant amount of chloroform was found in the car.
I also believe that CA and GA *knew*. I think that CA found out before she called 911. I also think that was the beginnings of the cover-up. When I first suggested that there were many that did not agree and that is okay but as more and more details become available I am understanding more why I thought that.
GA went to work the day that he smelled the ‘unmistakable’. I think I agree with whoever said it’s because Cindy said “get out of here, I’ll handle this”.
No matter what ‘denial’ Cindy may try to convince everyone around her she’s experiencing, she knows. There is not a mother/grandmother alive that if they smelled that smell would not confront their child about it. She confronted Casey and she got answers, maybe not truthful ones but at least ones that offered an explanation. It was from there that Casey, Lee and Cindy decided they better come up with something to protect Casey.
Snow? Hahaha.
My husband is outside in shorts and socks, working on a stabilizer rigging for his big yellow kayak.
My son is helping him.
If someone could help me out, I would appreciate it.
I think that GA did lie to the FBI. He stated that Casey’s purse and all it’s contents were in the front seat of the car. The FBI even asked, was Casey without ID for all that time and he said she was. If that is correct information, where did the wallet containing the $200.00 that Cindy pocketed come from? Didn’t Lee say that LE took some kind of card from behind her driver’s license? Didn’t Cindy also take back some credit cards that belonged to her? How then was Casey’s purse and contents all over the front seat per George?
If my facts are not in order please help. Thanks
I don’t think Cindy knew when she called 911. But, I do think that she found out AFTER the call was placed, and before the police arrived.
And, the three of them came up with the nanny story.
Casey Anthony can rest assure that no matter how this case ends up, she is going to prison for all of the days she has left to live.
My heart goes out to the grandparent’s especially her dad. I can never say I understand what they are going through, but I can say if Caylee is out there in a shallow grave, she will be found and she will come home to ahve a respectful burial like she deserves, not like her mother thinks she deserves, left out there like an animal to the element.
I do believe that justice for Caylee will be served. They have so much go on, her lies and her contradictions. Casey can take that all the way to the bank, oh, wait, all the way to hell….
Casey may have had a secondary purse that was at Tony L’s… and that’s probably where the money, and Cindy’s cards came from.
I have one purse that I use on a day to day basis. I have a really small purse that I have used for business socials (not much of those – that was back in January), and then i have the very wonderful theme park and camping belt pouch!
I don’t even think Hell would want her. Even the Devil has standards!
Tracy, Good questions. I maybe wrong but I thought Lee picked up Casey’s wallet when he when to Tony’s apartment to get her computer, etc.
Didn’t GA and CA bring the car home and empty it of all it’s contents ? Cindy said she put everything in a container on top of the washing machine… including the car seat and baby doll..I believe that is when she washed the slacks too.
Casey could have had two or more purses and two or more wallets too ???
I believe Lee dumped on the floor all the contents he brought back when he returned from Tony’s place…Casey had a few bags…don’t know if Lee referred to her purse as a bag or not, but he definitely said there was a wallet. That is when Cindy grabbed the money and LE took the card from behind the license.
Oh, I have very little doubt she “did it” I am just concerned that what they have is not enough to take a jury “beyond a reasonable doubt.”.
Chloroform is a good one, but again, anyone in the family (or whoever else had access to the computer) could have done the search, there are no pictures or receipts pointing to Casey buying chemicals to mix it, no witnesses who saw her make/carry/use it. It is found in her car, but again, there is nothing directly pointing to Casey (her car was abandoned, several people borrowed it, etc.), plus some amounts can be found in many everyday objects (not in such a high concentration though). Also chloroform is a well-known sedative – it goes more to the manslaughter charge (accidental overdose), than to premeditated murder – there has to be a specific intent to kill.
Who borrowed Casey’s car ?? I remember Casey saying that her father borrowed it but George said he never did.
Even Baez said that Casey was the sole driver of the car in the last hearing. (which made his entire defense team cringe…)
sway r u still here?
yep…hi Laura
Good evening all. The easiest Casey way to dispose of the body is undoubtly a dumpster. Everyone seems focused on the Amscot dumpster, but just because she left her car there doesn’t mean that’s the dumpster she used. I believe she was watching for a trash removal truck making their early morning rounds and then went ahead a little and used a dumpster that she knew would be picked up in a few minutes. I believe she waited in the shadows in the hours just before sun up to make sure that dumpster was off loaded and then . . . she made her way to Amscot and ditched the car. At that point, she was certain that the body was headed for the landfill and that was that. Done…nice and easy. LP said she would not have been able to lift a body up and into a dumpster, but many dumpsters have side doors. We have one behind our business in a small strip mall…out of sight of the main street … and easy…very easy.
Also, I don’t think Cindy is so much in denial – she is just trying to protect her daughter: if there are constant news stories about potential live Caylee sightings and the girl’s own grandparents appear full of confidence that Caylee is alive, who is going to convict the Mother (until the body is found anyway)? The jury would have heard about the tips, the searches, the news conferences. Would they not think – hey, the grandparents are convinced Caylee is alive, the evidence that she is not is questionable (that’s what the defense will try to show), may be she is?
Meanwhile Cindy knows her daughter, she is probably not that delusional about what Casey is capable of, but she may think that while nothing will bring Caylee back, she can still save Casey.
I did a search a while back on cloroform-Casey Anthony-Ricardo Morales and came across a porn site. It wasn’t Ricardo, but the guy’s site info was describing the act with her. Geesh! I have my comp set so I couldn’t click on it ( nor did I want to-ugh! ) but the description was way more than I wanted to know. Though provacative photos don’t necessarily mean pornographic, after running across that site, I’d believe they were porn.
ivana. be careful on murts site, Its bad over there ever since i went there while the search was going on ,i have had nothing but computer problems so has a lot of people on here, just be careful that site is full of hackers and viruses, ok i just dont want u to have any problems
Anyone know what happened to Murt’s site?
orlandosentinel.com/news/local/orange/orl-casey2208nov22,0,6489381.story
It looks like GA was hanging with kidfinders today !
KC is not worth saving.
WL – I whole heartedly agree with that dumpster theory.
I don’t remember where I saw the statement about someone borrowing Casey’s car – I think it was in an interview she had with the social workers or something like that (I think when she was on home confinement). Plus the car was abandoned and later towed – so it was not in Casey’s possession for some time.
Even if no one had access to the car, the difference between direct and circumstantial evidence is still there: someone searching for a chloroform recipe, some amount is found in the trunk, Caylee is missing, there is some evidence of human decomposition in the car. This is a far cry from, say, Casey buying chemicals to mix chloroform (videotaped by the local home depot), Caley’s body is then found in the trunk and is determined to contain huge amounts of chloroform. Even then there is not a 100% premeditation for murder, let alone with what LE has now.
The PA will have to show with Casey’s actions and behavior that Casey killed Caylee.
Casey couldn’t risk the body being found, so she had to dispose of the body in such a manner that it could not be found or identified.
WL….I think you are right. Killer disposed of Caylee in a dumpster, but not the one where she left the car. Your idea that killer studied trash pick up in the area is perfect. I always figured she left the poor baby’s body in a dumpster other than the one where she left the car but I never thought about her studying the travel routes of trash trucks. That’s what she did. She made sure Caylee would be picked up right away. Such a clever little killer. Not only has she murdered her baby daughter – she is also, step by step, killing her parents as well
I think a jury will be able to convict on Murder One. Chloroform searches and the amounts found in the car. I believe they can come to a premeditated decision by reasoning that she was fully aware this substance could be fatal. So she knowingly sedated her child with a substance known to be fatal if used improperly, especially on a small child. At least that’s how I would see it as a juror. And I think any jury is going to be more harsh in a case involving a helpless child.
IMHO, anyone is worth saving, especially a child to her mother.
George Anthony admits hiding from his wife and son the fact that sheriff’s detectives had found over 1,000 provocative photos of Casey retrieved from the family’s computers, cameras and online.
Later in the interview, George Anthony all but admits the odor he smelled in his daughter car was the odor of decomposition. He also reveals that Casey Anthony was stealing cash from Caylee’s piggy bank.
In another interview, Cindy Anthony points to friends of her daughter as being involved in Caylee’s disappearance.
DID U ALL KNOW THERE WAS SO MANY PHOTOS OF CASEY? I BET LE IS KEEPING SOME QUIET, ALSO I DIDNT KNOW GEROGE KEPT IT FROM CINDY AND LEE, MAYBE I SHOULD GO BACK AND LISTEN TO THE TAPES, OHH I CANT DO IT THOUGH.
Another key point to argue that it wasn’t an accident was her failure to notify authorities right away.
Why wait 31 days?
Amazing how CA was able to pin the zanny label on first amy then ricardo, saying killer was speaking in code, yet by the end of the interview she had completely reverted back to the ‘zanny took the baby at the park’ theory. She can’t even tell the same story twice she is such a liar.
SheilaB, there has to be a mens rea or a specific intent to kill for the 1st degree. Even “depraved heart” and “reckless disregard for human life” does not get 1st degree in every state. My gut reaction (and sincere hope) is that the prosecutor knows what he is doing and saw something like that get a conviction before, so even if it does not add up to me, it’ll still appear convincing enough at the trial.
Absolutely FLMom,
and if you look at some child abuse cases, parents will actually harm their children then rush them to the ER for medical treatment, of course, explaining, they fell down, or whatever. But the point is, normal behavior, especially an accident would be to seek help.
It’s certainly possible that she had more than one purse. The question from the FBI was “so she went all that time without ID?” George said “yes”. It is correct that Lee brought back a wallet from Tony’s house and Lee said that a card of some sort was removed from behind her driver’s license.
I don’t know what the relevance of that is, other than the FBI may have been establishing the fact that if George would tell one lie, then maybe he would tell other lies.
law student,
I would consider specific intent as the act of administering chloroform if it can be proven this was used.
Law student and mom~
You make some excellent points and I do agree from what we know at this point it is mostly circumstancial evidence.
What has been released up to this point has been all preliminary evidence from the neglect charges.
We do not have all of the discovery yet from the Murder indictment. We have heard nothing about the results of the stain in the trunk nor have we heard about the results from the bag that was removed that may have contained maggots.
The public has not been informed of everything that LE has. They have remained tight lipped but very certain that the child is dead. I am confident in the process and am willing to wait before I come to any conclusion at this point.
Hey Laura, the FBI did mention in the interview with George that while they wouldn’t release those photos of Casey (that she had tried to erase, but were recovered from the hard drive), that chances were if they were on his pc, they were on others’ computers as well, and very well could come out in the future.
Just in my experience… I have 2 driver’s licenses. My puppy took off with one out of my purse, and it wound up under a throw rug. I found it after I got my new one. She could have had to DL’s.
Holden – I’ve been thinking about that for weeks now. I was watching our trash removal truck picking up our business dumpster early one morning and the thought occurred to me that Casey must have cased out a trash truck on it’s route in the pre-dawn hours. I’m convinced that’s what happened. That’s why she says she doesn’t know where Caylee is. Amongst all her lies…that’s the truth. That’s why she’s not worried about a body being found in Blanchard Park or any other park for that matter.
From Orlando Senitnel tonight: (finally some folks are objecting to these pohotos being released!
Slew of sightings reported, but still no Caylee Anthony
Bianca Prieto | Sentinel Staff Writer
November 22, 2008
George and Cindy Anthony received a photo of a girl with brown hair (center) playing at the Florida Mall.
The picture released Friday shows a brown-haired, round-faced little girl playing with other children at a playground inside Florida Mall. A similar-looking child was spotted at a grocery store in Gainesville earlier this month.
Could either be Caylee Marie Anthony? The answer so far, to these and similar sightings, has been no.
People from across the country continue to send tips and pictures to the Orange County Sheriff’s Office and the Anthony family, claiming to have spotted Caylee.
Sheriff’s officials won’t say how many tips they have received, but the family regularly mentions new ones.
Caylee, whose 3rd birthday was in August, has not been seen since June. Her mother, 22-year-old Casey Anthony, is charged with killing her. Because of that, sheriff’s detectives no longer investigate such tips.
Grandparents still hope
Still, grandparents George and Cindy Anthony remain hopeful they will find the girl alive.
“Every lead that we have, that we are still investigating, gives the Anthonys hope that Caylee Marie is still alive,” Michelle Bart, the family spokeswoman, said Friday. “We hope to bring her home soon.”
They urge anyone with information to call their hotline. As of Friday afternoon, no one had called to say they recognized the child in the latest photo.
Earlier this month, Caylee was thought to have been spotted in a Gainesville grocery store. The tipster called the Crimeline number in Orlando to report the sighting, but after getting what they saw as an inadequate response, turned to the Anthonys for help, Bart said.
Gainesville police tracked down the little girl and found she was not Caylee. The family had to produce a birth certificate along with photo albums as proof that she was their child, said Deputy Carlos Padilla, an Orange sheriff’s spokesman.
“We are no longer looking for a live child,” Padilla said of his agency. “All of the evidence that we have indicates that she is dead, and we are confident that that is the case, unfortunately.”
The Anthony family is thankful that the Gainesville police followed up on the tip, Bart said.
Concern for other kids:
While the Anthonys hold out hope, others worry that other children are being dragged into the case.
Orange Sheriff Kevin Beary has received e-mails from residents concerned about images of young children broadcast and published, Padilla said.
One woman from Mississippi wrote to Beary and begged that he put an end to it, Padilla said. Her e-mail warned of child predators or pornographers manipulating the photos of thechildren.
“If I were a parent I would be sick to think my child had been displayed on the Internet,” the woman wrote. “To have these innocent children publicly interjected into this case is wrong and absolutely can not happen. Please help.”
Bianca Prieto can be reached at bprieto@orlandosentinel.com or 407-420-5620.
Meant *two* DL’s. But you probably knew what I meant…
Jeanne1807, on November 22nd, 2008 at 6:42 pm Said:
Could Caylee be in some rented storage unit somewhere.
It baffles everybody..where is she.
=====
Reminds me of a story:
A few years ago a man had a storage unit in another city and told his new wife to be sure to pay the bill every month and then when they were short of money she stopped paying the bill and didn’t tell him. After a couple months of not paying the owners broke the lock and went in and there was a body in a freezer. The husband was sent to prison for murder.
PAY YOUR STORAGE UNIT RENTAL BILL
FLMom, that’s why I am very surprised Baez is not doing some type of insanity defense. He either has to be sure that the body is not going to be found, that there is enough confusion to not burst the nanny bubble, or that the state forensic evidence is really weak. I think once the defense expert witness reports are released, it will be easier to see what his strategy is, but I am still confused about the lack of a psychiatric expert.
Tracy ~ I hear your point but I guess my question to you is : How would George KNOW if Casey had another ID or not. ? I think he is just answering the question to the best of his ability to FBI …when he says she didn’t have her ID…
He couldn’t possible know for sure could he ?
Think of all the other things George thought he knew about his daughter and found them to be a lie.
BJ- PAY YOUR STORAGE UNIT RENTAL BILL
Hahahaha- words to live by!
caryn,
I DO
#1Laura good advice. I was on Murts site and my computer was acting funny. I haven’t been back on and things seem to have cleared up. I have a very new computer and the latest in virus protection. So I hope I am ok but I am not going back.
Law student and mom. Good questions. Ones I myself asked the other day. Well not as well as you did but I asked. Somebody and for the life of me I can’t remember explained reasonable doubt and the other “thingy” where there is a presumption of the crime from the evidence. Darn I keep forgetting what that is called. Anyway they made so much sense. If anybody else remembers who it is maybe you can go back through the different days and hit Control and F. It might let you find that conversation with the keyword..that I can’t remember. Oh well you are a law student you know what I mean.
Some of it was explained like this. If somebody is accused of stealing a large sum of money. Lately they have been spending more than they could possibly have or earn then you have the “suspecion” that they might have stolen the money.
Maybe the person that gave me all that info..will surface and explain it to you. It was good.
Law student mom: The most telling thing, forensically, will be from maggots recovered from the trunk of the car. We’ve done research, and YES, maggots who feed on human flesh most definitely will contain DNA of the human body that they have been feeding upon. (we know this is gross, but it’s true.)
I wonder if LE has check the Sawgrass apartments for any sign of Casey for Jun 20 – 27th..
She said that she has left Caylee at Sawgrass.
Maybe she disposed of Caylee’s body in a dumpster at Sawgrass, knowing when the truck would make the pick up…
BJ- your sense of humor reminds me of one of my favorite family members. It’s almost uncanny.
“First-degree murder
Definition
: a murder that is committed with premeditation or during the course of a serious felony (as kidnapping) or that otherwise (as because of extreme cruelty) requires the most serious punishment under the law ”
or during the course of a serious felony – this to me covers the chloroform and other things prosecutors can throw out, how about aggravated child abuse, and extreme cruelty applies.
WL–your theory of her casing the trash truck makes perfect sense.
Zenga–I hope the OCSO does do something quickly.
Not to go off topic too much but I watched the Ashley Dupree interview on GMA the other morning and I have to say I never felt very strongly about Casey’s involvement in prostitution until that interview. My change of heart came when I heard the story of such a beautiful young girls involvement. If you saw Ashley on the street, you would never guess, nor did those who know and love her. Since that interview I too have decided that it’s not that far fetched for Casey to have been involved in prostitution, or an escort business of some sort. Except, seems she would have made enough money to not have to rob her baby’s piggy bank.
Sheila B, I voted “not sure” above on the survey, but you have more more and more convinced that I should have answered “yes”.
Wow, I am a typing disaster tonight- I meant you have “me” more and more convinced…. yikes.
FLmomof2 – Sawgrass dumpster would be right up there in convenience for Casey.
I would bet though, seeing as they did search landfills, the Sawgrass dump spot would have been one of the first ones they hit, along with the Amscot, right? Makes sense that she would have cased out a garbage truck though… to make sure the evidence was in and out…
Sway, I hope so. From what I understand, the expert and lay witness lists are coming in for the murder charge, but I may be wrong. Do you think there will be additional evidence disclosure for the murder case? I thought because the “lying to authorities” charge remained, the murder charge got swapped for the child neglect, but the disclosed evidence still applies to the current case. That should be easy to check through the docket numbers I guess. In any event, my hat will definitely go off to FL prosecutor if s/he can get a 1st degree on this one.
Casey has already been on tape saying that she’s not crazy, and she met with shrinks in the jail that said there was nothing wrong with her. She’s not mentally insane, and she knows right from wrong – which is also evidence from her call 911 when the protestors were outside the house throwing nickles and rocks.
Tracy – she’d have to have done it that way. Makes more sense then most other theories.
WL I too don’t think she went to much trouble. I don’t see her tramping through woods or driving out to remote places and digging holes.
I did have the cemetary theory that was shot down.
However regarding the dumpster or rain drains..she had to be really darn lucky. In Florida with the weather always so warm there are people out and about all the time. Offices being cleaned at odd times, security cameras and security people. She had to hit it just right.
Tracy: Who knows what OCSO will do about all the photos released to the public supposedly being “Caylee”. However, we have to agree that you just don’t put all these pics out there to the public unless you are sure it is Caylee!
Could you imagine all the different scenarios that might occur if she got off?
sway–good point, and just what I was looking for. Sometimes I need assistance in not being so one-way thinking.
I have a crazy question. Would Baez be held in contempt if during cross-examination he asked questions to witnesses that implied he believed his client to be guilty? I know someone is thinking, ‘why would he’? I don’t think its likely but nothing at this point, concerning this case, would surprise me and just wanted to know if he could.
By the way they did check several dumpsters and the dump where they were emptied. They came up empty. But then..it would be like a needle in a haystack.
Zenga, that is definitely gross, but useful. Again, though, even if Caylee’s body was in Casey’s trunk, it does not mean Casey planned to kill her daughter.
WL–Yes, your theory makes more sense than most and I think I’m on board with yours. I can’t believe what I’m saying considering all the choices I had.
A smidge of the research we did:
Human and insect mitochondrial DNA analysis from maggots.Wells JD, Introna F Jr, Di Vella G, Campobasso CP, Hayes J, Sperling FA.
Department of Justice Sciences, University of Alabama at Birmingham, 35294, USA.
During the course of our forensic investigations, we have encountered situations where it would have been useful to have evidence, other than direct contact between the two, for concluding that a carrion-fly maggot developed on a particular human victim. If a maggot collected during a death investigation did not develop on the victim, then its age is not relevant to estimating the postmortem interval. In this study we demonstrate that mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) sequence data can be obtained from the dissected gut of a maggot that had fed on human tissue. These data can be used to identify both the human corpse upon which the maggot had been feeding and the species of the maggot itself.
PMID: 11373008 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
If you want more info, just google “human DNA in maggots”.
Law student and mom~
You are correct the witness lists for the murder case are coming in…I do not think either side is complete as of yet though. ….They are allowed to add up to trial if I am not mistaken ?
I am sure Casey will do time…how much and what degree is still the question.
We are all hoping for the time to fit the crime.
Caryn, so much time had passed since she disposed of the body in a dumpster that I doubt a search of a landfill would unearth anything. I’m no expert on landfills for sure, but surely not all trash companys utilize computerized systems to track where they dump their loads. My hubby drives a concrete truck and his truck has a GPS that lets his dispatcher know exactly where he is at all times. The large trash removals companies like EWS (Environmental Waster Services) here in Florida probably have GPS technology in their newer trucks. But, smaller independant trash removal companys, like the ones owned by your average Joe 6-pack, probably don’t have the technology. Anyway…that’s my theory and I’m stickin’ to it.
Sway I asked that question the other day when Baez list of witnesses came out. Can he add witnesses up til trial?
I would guess he doesn’t want to give much away. Sneaky Snake that he is.
Sneaky Snake
i like it Jeanne…it fits him !
Contempt of Court is disruption in court proceedings.
The line of questioning, thought, could have legal or ethical ramifications with the FL Bar.
law student and mom, on November 22nd, 2008 at 8:26 pm Said:
Zenga, that is definitely gross, but useful. Again, though, even if Caylee’s body was in Casey’s trunk, it does not mean Casey planned to kill her daughter.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Yes, Law student mom, it IS very gross (sorry)! And you are correct – it still does not “prove” Casey killed her daughter. One must look at ALL the other evidence to form a conclusion beyond reasonable doubt. And there is SO much more evidence.
I agree with you, WL- I think at this point they will not find anything in a landfill. I was thinking they’d searched a couple months back, which even then would have been a difficult task.
To call him a Sneaky Snake degrades the song by Tom T Hall.
How ’bout a slimy snake?
law student and mom–I think you are being met with ‘mild’ resistance because what you are saying makes perfect sense. If what you are saying can be conveyed to 12 people in the same room then the outcome is not something anyone of us wants to see happen. I completely understand and respect what you are saying but I think I could consider the “circumstancial” evidence alone and find her guilty. It’s too much. Too much ‘reasonable’ doubt. Besides, I think you are smarter than Baez and he’ll never be able to convince one juror, let alone 12 of them.
Law student mom: Just wondering about your theories as to who else may have killed Caylee? Especially since the DA has information and evidence that it was Caylee’s body in the trunk.
We are so glad you are here! You are a wealth of information! Thanks!
SheilaB, again, would not you have prove the commission of a felony and the fact that Caylee’s death resulted from/occurred during that felony? For example, if Casey sedated Caylee with chloroform and left her in the trunk (probably sufficient for aggravated child abuse), you would have to actually prove that (again, beyond a reasonable doubt) AND the fact that it resulted in Caylee’s death. Hard to do without a body. Actually, even if the body is found, it may be hard to determine the cause of death now.
However, there is also another provision for the 1st degree in FL, involving a distribution of a controlled substance (don’t know if chloroform is one of them):
3. Which resulted from the unlawful distribution of any substance controlled under s. 893.03(1), cocaine as described in s. 893.03(2)(a)4., or opium or any synthetic or natural salt, compound, derivative, or preparation of opium by a person 18 years of age or older, when such drug is proven to be the proximate cause of the death of the user,
is murder in the first degree and constitutes a capital felony, punishable as provided in s. 775.082.
Again, there has to be proof that the drug was distributed AND that it was the proximate cause of death. In other words, it is not enough that Caylee was given the drug, she specifically had to have died from it.
For comparison, though, here is the 2nd degree – also can be done during commission of a felony (such as aggravated child abuse), just without the intent to kill:
(2) The unlawful killing of a human being, when perpetrated by any act imminently dangerous to another and evincing a depraved mind regardless of human life, although without any premeditated design to effect the death of any particular individual, is murder in the second degree and constitutes a felony of the first degree, punishable by imprisonment for a term of years not exceeding life or as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
And manslaughter:
(3) A person who causes the death of any person under the age of 18 by culpable negligence under s. 827.03(3) commits aggravated manslaughter of a child, a felony of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
What do you think?
if you think about it, unless a crime is committed and caught on videotape, every case is circumstantial.
I really think the 31 days is really going to play very heavily on the minds of the jurors, as well as George’s interview about Cindy being the first one to hold Caylee, and Caylee running to Cindy and George before running to mommy.
How’s this for some nice FICTION reporting.
Cindy told WKMG: “George and I and Casey and Lee will walk up to our maker and not have any problems going into the gates of heaven, because we have not done anything wrong.”
RJ, on November 22nd, 2008 at 8:42 pm Said:
How’s this for some nice FICTION reporting.
Cindy told WKMG: “George and I and Casey and Lee will walk up to our maker and not have any problems going into the gates of heaven, because we have not done anything wrong.”
______
Did she fail to mention Caylee, because she has already done so, do you think??
I’m sure there is proof that Caylee was left in the trunk.
And, I wonder as to how her friends would testify about Caylee sleeping through loud parties in which the cops are called out at 1 am because of the noise. (That’s an example, that was one that Casey missed, but you get my drift – how can a child sleep through all that loud noise?)
I’m gonna run. Goodnight all.
Play nice.
FLMomOf2, on November 22nd, 2008 at 8:41 pm Said:
I really think the 31 days is really going to play very heavily on the minds of the jurors
Yes, FLMom – we agree – no mother (with a conscience) lets her child go missing for that amount of time and does not report it!
Me too…good night all
law student and mom–I posted earlier about a Crime Stories show I watched today. It was the “woodchipper murder” in CT in 1986. Ironically, it was the first conviction in a murder case without a body in the US. Although the “body” was never recovered and the cause of death unknown the husband was found guilty, not in the first trial (one-lone juror) but in the second trial. The evidence appeared to be air tight and I was in disbelief about the mistrial but was relieved know the man was convicted of 1st degree murder in the second trial.
Lawyer Mom,
The First Degreee Murder charge also provides for the commission of a felony such as aggravated child abuse. I’m not saying it can’t be reduced down to 2nd degree or manslaughter, but it does certainly hold true for First Degree Murder as well. Couple that with all the circumstantial evidence, Casey’s behavior and lack of cooperation with law enforcement,not reporting the child missing for 31 days, etc. and it is my opinion that she will get Murder One.
RJ, on November 22nd, 2008 at 8:42 pm Said:
How’s this for some nice FICTION reporting.
Cindy told WKMG: “George and I and Casey and Lee will walk up to our maker and not have any problems going into the gates of heaven, because we have not done anything wrong.”
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Pure rationalization! That’s what we say about it – pure rationalization. The Anthonys rationalize everything it seems, and it’s really very sad.
Hi Sway ~
Long time no see!!!!
I’ve been so busy with the new developments … not much time to blog.
Hope to catch you soon!
Yes Caryn, I do. I also think that when it is our time we won’t be seeing any of the Anthony clan there.
FLMOM
I think that poor child slept through it because she was drugged. Plain and simple.
Law student and mom, while I appreciate everything you’re saying, and it is the letter of the law, we are relying on 12 jurors in a highly emotional case. And unlike our presidential elections, we don’t have a judicial college to make sure we “make the right choice” as we do with the electoral college. This is an emotional case, and knowing what I’ve seen about Baez, he does not seem so credible as to be able to illicit a response from jurors as far as just the law in its bare bones, logical form . I tend to think the emotional factor is going to affect the hearts and minds of these jurors, and I hope in doing so Casey is found guilty. Just my opinion (and my hope). And that could be because I’m not so rational after months of obsessing with Caylee’s disappearance. I know that isn’t the case with the general population, but I think once the circumstancial evidence is heard, most people won’t have a reasonable doubt. It’s an overwhelming case…
Zenga, my theory is that Casey killed Caylee. Maybe not “intentionally”, but that does not make it any less horrible. After she got the new boyfriend she was trying very hard to impress, the child became a huge burden. Caylee was right in her “terrible twos”, very active (someone mentioned she always tried to get on the phone when Casey was speaking), demanded a lot of attention and otherwise acted like any vibrant 2yo girl would (I have three little girls myself – can’t imagine having enough time for a shower, let alone a new boyfriend and clubbing). Casey did not have patience for that – she may have figured she could keep Caylee sedated when she could not get her parents to watch the girl. Thus chloroform. She probably left her in the trunk and there could be a number of reasons the girl died – overdose, asphyxiation, overheating (I don’t know what the weather is like in FL in June, but imagine it is warm). Casey freaked, but figured that just like she lied her way out of everything else in her life, she’ll get out of this one too. So I have very little doubt Casey killed her daughter.
I am just concerned that there is not enough to convict her of the 1st degree. I am also wondering whether it could have been better to charge her with 2nd degree or manslaughter – 1st degree involves a high burden of proof to carry even with the most solid evidence.
I would like to see Casey being held responsible for her behavior at least once in her life, and I am worried that may be the prosecution “overshot” the charge a bit for that to happen. Especially considering that if she is acquitted, double jeopardy concept may prevent further charges.
I don’t think the prosecutors overshot the charge at all. There is also an aggravated mansaughter charge which would give the jury a lesser charge to go to. And that charge has left the door open for a plea bargain if she will cooperate and tell them where the body is.
The way I see it, the ball is in her court right now. She can admit the truth or look at a Murder One conviction, and I personally feel confident they will get it with or without a body.
However, I do feel that were Casey to tell the truth and lead them to the body, a lesser charge would be more appropiate. I don’t believe this was premeditated, but a case of severe negigence which spiraled out of control simply because of her familial dysfunction.
SheilaB, that’s the thing, if she is not charged with 2nd degree or manslaughter, the jury can still convict her of that in FL if there is not enough for 1st degree, right?
Caryn, I hope so too. However, the jury will receive jury instructions (from both Baez and prosecution) which will outline the law they must apply the facts to. If they make an emotional decision inconsistent with the law and the facts, Baez can move for all kinds of post-verdict crap.
In terms of witnesses, I think they still have time to supplement, but all witnesses and all experts (and their reports) have to be in by the close of discovery (don’t know the exact schedule, but should be something like 2 weeks before trial).
Oh, well that makes it much better then – I missed that she was charged with aggravated manslaughter too. That one should be fairly easy even with the circumstantial evidence and without the body.
Law student and mom- btw- how are you able to manage being a law student and a mother of multiple children?? That is awesome!!
I have a couple of question maybe someone can help me with. i have read this blog for months and you all are great folks. In reference to the therory of caylee put into the pool to cover up…make look like accident…when the body farm did the air testing would there not be chemicals from that pool chlorine and muriatic(sp) acid i have a above ground pool and i know espically during the summer how much chemicals it takes and a body (dead) would get that into thier lungs if submurged in the pool. just wondering if anyone has addressed this before? also i would like to know how long a person has to be dead for a cavadaver dog to hit on a spot… as cindy implies an accident and caylee was layed on the ground for a few minutes right after death i do not think the dogs would hit on that spot yet that they are there to locate a decomposing body not sure ….anyone with a opinion?
Casey plotted and murdered her child. She resented the fact that Cindy would not let her give the Caylee up for adoption. At first it gave her attention. But during the last while, parties and men were more fun. Casey resented being “stuck” with her child. She never felt like a mother, she was the high paid nanny who helped herself to Cindy’s bank account and credit cards because Cindy caused the problem.
If someone else was to blame in this murder, Casey would not be sitting in jail. All of her friends have left her and will be testifying for the prosecution. There is no reason for Casey to protect anyone. Casey looks after herself and herself only. Therefore, Casey committed the crime by herself, and is not protecting anyone. She has been caught in all of her lies, and for the first time in her life, no one can cover for her. Everyone sees through her.
txdschoolnurse
For chemicals to get into the lungs the person needs to be alive and breathing
zak you are the one i thought could have an answer to my questions you seem very well informed and smart
Zak,
I go back and forth on whether or not this was premeditated. Today I say not, but that changes as quickly as this case does, lol
i agree with that zak but dont you think some of those chemicals would show up in trace amounts
Law student mom: “I would like to see Casey being held responsible for her behavior at least once in her life, and I am worried that may be the prosecution “overshot” the charge a bit for that to happen. Especially considering that if she is acquitted, double jeopardy concept may prevent further charges.”
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Man oh man – we ALL would love to see Casey held responsible for her behavior, especially toward her daughter, Caylee! We see what you are articulating about in your posts – but double jeobardy? We think not..
Mostly because of the overwhelming circumstantial evidence in this case so far. And we (all of us) do not even know at this point in time what additional evidence the PA has in his/her bag at this point. There is SO much more to come. Guess we will have to wait and see it.
We love it that you play “devil’s advocate” – it certainly gives us some things to think about!! thanks so much!
i do think premeditated i work with special needs kids and have seen some horible parents and i do believe casey acted on premedition
lawstudent, I completely agree with your above 8:57 post, this is also why finding caylles remains are so important to this case, do you have any theories on why LE has not made a better effort to find them? Yes I quess it could be behind the scenes but with this case as we all know leaks are all the time i just feel it would have gotten out, Tim Miller and LP seems like the only oneswhi searched, for me thats not good enough LE should and needs to find he remains. Any thoughts..
I also sometimes go back and forth, but there are things that say premed. You have to understand the antisocial behavior disorder and know how these people think and act. I am also leaning toward Disassociative Identity Disorder (multiple personalities) to explain her behavior. I believe her problems are caused by drug use (ecstasy) and watching horror movies to the point where she isn’t able to distinguish between right and wrong. I think she was following a script- “American Psycho’.
i completely believe that the pool statements made by cindy are a way to fall back on an accident (ladder being moved) just in case things do not work out with puting the blame on others
i do totally agree with the unable to distinguish between right and wrong i believe casey can completely take on a story and in her head it is true
Zenga,
or Anyone,
Did they analyze any of the maggots found in the trunk?
I haven’t read that in the forensics. Just wondering.
I would imagine if they had, the scientist who discovered it would be on the witness list. I didn’t see any experts on the witness list posted. Perhaps they will show up later with the final report.
Zak – you have always posted amazing and interesting theories, and we respect that you do! You’ve been right on about a number of theories! We, also, go back & forth, about pre-meditation. Today we are thinking YES, pre-meditation. Yesterday we were thiniking “an accident”. Go figure.
Here’s something that was brought up a couple weeks ago and I just want to send out new “feelers”.
For those of you that believe that Casey chloroformed Caylee more than just a few times and left her in the trunk to sleep, have you considered that on the nights that GA and CA were not taking care of her that she may have been sleeping at Uncle Lee’s house?
I don’t know where I stand on this yet. Just looking for some other opinions.
I agree txschoolnurse, no pool involved here.
Trunk, choloform and or zanax. Simple casey wanted to be with Tony, she gave caylle something to make her sleep in the trunk, she oded or suffacated. Casey drove around with her remains for a while then either buried them or put them in a dumpstor, I feel she buried them.
i being a nurse have heard of xanax reffered to as zannies tons of times and months ago when i heard of this case (thank you NG) that was the first thing i thought that she was saying zanny had the child meaning she was druged by xanax
the buried theory is one i have thought of a lot because of the several statements of dirt found in the trunk
yes i have also txschoolnurse, zanny is a street name for zanax. All the younger people call it that.
#1Laura, I honestly lost track of the recent search efforts (I just know they did not bring up much). My thought is that the lack of finding is not due to lack of effort – there is just lots of area to cover: parks, lakes, landfills, etc. and this is a little child. Even if she was not burned or placed in a dumpster, the remains could have been destroyed by animals.
spelt zannies u r right also,not zanny.
Curious Dee, on November 22nd, 2008 at 9:24 pm Said: Zenga,
or Anyone,
Did they analyze any of the maggots found in the trunk?
I haven’t read that in the forensics. Just wondering.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From what we have read, the FBI did in fact take the maggots into the crime lab for consideration of evidence. Actually it was Leonard Padilla who first mentioned “evidence on the plastic bag” that had been sent in for investigation. We have not heard publicly what the FBI or the labs have found out about those maggots.
Hey #1Laura–just a suggestion. I think you were gone for a little while. Go up the thread and read WL’s theory. It makes so much sense. It’s about the dumpster vs. buried. I think she swayed a couple people tonight. I know she put me on a committed path that I can’t say before tonight I was on one.
The best person to ask about the maggots is MauraL She seems very up to date about that.
cindys video just really drives me crazy and if i were amy or jessie i would be really really upset at this point esp. amy she mad e her sound so back and at one point the FBI guy confirming her name sounded like zanny
I know lawstudent but LE hasnt searched very much if at all in the begining maybe a littile, and LP and Tim Miller did what they could, for me I dont understand why LE hasnt made it a priitory to look them selves. Maybe im very emotional about this because i would like her properly buried, I know we all do.Also it would extremelly help this case.
Zenga–I think I’m confused, help if you can. Is the only mention of maggots from Leonard Padilla or has LE or FBI made such mention? I know there has been lots of chatter about maggots but don’t know if any “reputable” source has confirmed that maggots were in the trunk or anywhere else. Tell me what you know. Thanks.
Uncle Lee
I don’t think Casey saw him very often. GA made the comment that Lee distanced himself after Casey hid her pregnancy. Maybe the truth is he was angry about the way it came about. Casey sent Lee messages saying that it was good to see you after 3 weeks (etc). Lee went looking for Casey on July 3 because either both parents or Cindy asked him to find her. Casey ditched Lee before he got to the restauant/bar. Casey had something private going on and Lee was not a part of it. Lee was also away on business much of the time and he had a roommate.
Thanks to all for the very informative posts this evening – you folks are amazing. nite
Could Cindy wind up being sued by Annie and Jesse over these allegations by Cindy of them taking or harming Caylee?
I’m not sure of the implications there but if it were me who had been stolen from by casey and now CA is saying i am zanny according to all the “clues” crazy casey has been handing out i would look into a legal way to clear my name
not to mention amy lead cindy to casey to start with with out her we dont even know about caylee yet
Just a thought – if George was a homicide investigator, Casey probably heard of some cases he worked on where some type of body disposal was involved. Do you think it would be helpful to take a look at his prior work to see if there is a case where a body was hidden very well and not found for a long time (or not at all). I doubt Casey is extremely bright – she probably got some good ideas about hiding Caylee from Daddy’s stories.
zak–I hope they do!! I really hope so!!
and horror movies!!!!!
Zak,
that was my first thought when Cindy layed that one out. If I were them i would be talking to Zenaida’s attorney and Id file something, frivilous or not, that ticked me off. Here’s Amy who was a victim of Casey’s thieving and her mother is pointing the finger at her, my jaw dropped on that one.
law student
George was a deputy sheriff from what I understand. Also, it sounds like he left that job before Casey was born.
Hellllllp me. Ok I just finished listening to Cindy A for three tapes. All I can say is I bet the FBI agent went running out of that office straight to the tavern for at least three or four drinks. Have mercy.
She is the worst liar and she is such a control person. She took over that entire interview with her..mouth.
Her famous words when asked…when you got home with Casey did you ask her why did Amy think she was moving into our house? Per Cindy .. I am not going to speculate..my focus was on Caylee.
when asked did you ask Casey why she abandoned the car at Amscot…per Cindy..I am not going to speculate…my focus was on Caylee.
She is like Houdini. She escapes..in and out.
I’m not overwhelmed by the amount of circumstanial evidence. As I see it, the witnesses for the prosecution will some how hurt the case. LE has yet to ask the tough questions. As for motive, the only motive we have here is that Caylee was getting in Casey’s way and preventing her from having a good time. Caylee had never been in the way before, what was the problem now? Her mother wanted custody of Caylee.
She could have walked out at any time. It wasn’t a matter of child support, Casey wasn’t getting any.
To me Casey’s actions are one of a person who is not guilty. Unless she is a true Multilple Personality Disorder, if there is such a thing. But maybe.
I believe Jesse when he said he heard Caylee in the background on the phone on June 24th. The defense without a doubt will use that fact, whether he recants his story or not. The audio was too convincing the way he recalls it. That puts the date of the dirty deed after June 24th. Where was Caylee between June 16th and June 24th? On June 18th Casey is borrowing a shovel, the 19th backing her car up to the garage, the 22nd stealing gas cans. Who’s lying and why? This will be a point brought up by the defense. Then we have the car which was out of Casey’s possession for 2 wks. from June 30th to July 15th. Antother point that will be made. Tow truck driver has a cold and doesn’t remember any odd odor and that was on June 27th.
Casey was in on something. Caylee is presumed dead as it should be. Everything points to that, but a jury will expect Caylee’s DNA in the stain causing the odor of decomposition. Will they get it? Caylee’s entire DNA is in the possession of the lab that did the paternity test for Jesse. The motive is iffy. The forensics are not conclusive. Perhaps a lesser charge than 1st degree murder would get her convicted. IMO
law student and mom–Casey Anthony is so smug in the face of possible life in prison. It’s disheartening and disgusting to say the least. That girl made a mistake————somewhere. So yes, if GA past can offer even the slightest chance of additional insight then I say LOOK. Leave no stone unturned for the sake of justice for Baby Caylee.
#1Laura – maybe LE has some info that convinced them that a search for the body would not be very successful. Also, at this point, the body would probably be in such a condition that the cause of death may not be easily determined (if at all). For example, chloroform stays in a human body only for a few days, right?
Considering that the LE would be predominantly concerned with evidence and the cause of death, and not necessarily so much the proper burial, they may just want to conserve the effort.
i just loved the statement from cindy that casey would not abandon the car and it was a good car she would go back for it …….what about a good daughter would she abandon her ????
law student,
I agree with conserving the effort. First, the huge amount of time and resources probably left them overwhelmed and unable to conduct a large search. This is a large area with a high crime rate and they were probably at their limit when this case became so sensationalized. Just look at all the psychic tips that came in, did you see the paperwork? Each tip had about a 4-5 page follow up procedure. They followed the facts and are relying on their scientific evidence. I believe there’s way more to come forensically.
And why would they exhaust their resources on a child that had been missing for 31 days, the mother was not cooperating, she purposely lied to investigators and mislead them, coupled with the smell and the stain, what conclusion would any investigator be forced to draw?? I’m sure they have to make tough choices every day in how to prioritize their case load. This one seemed a no brainer from the beginning. Gather evidence and proceed to prosecute.
Just to add my nickle to the conversation. I still say that Caseys silence and Baez cat that swollowed the mouse look on his face will lead us down the path of a suprise at trial. Once again I bring up OJ’s glove and Mary Winklers shoe. Look for this trial to have a suprise.
By the way,we haven’t talked about the kind of jurors each side would want. I know they have special people that help them pick the jury. Is there enough money to hire them? What do you think they will look for?
Also, tongue in cheek, will Cindy take over for the judge and be in charge of the courtroom?
Look for all of these developments.
Does anybody else find themselves looking for a substitute for the word *absolutely*???
Hey Jeanne,
I might agree with you, but also look at Scott Peterson’s trial. The defense was smug, they made comments all along that they were going to prove their client was innocent. At the end of the day, they put on almost no defense, they just paraded a bunch of witnesses in to say what a “good guy” he was. That was the defense. He’s on death row now.
Tracy
Absolutely!!!!
I live in Florida near Orlando and I can insure you in June the temp. was in the 90s even at nite to put someone in the trunk the temp would rise to 120 in a very short time 1 hour maybe 2 anyone would be dead. you would not need any chloroform or zannax. i believe her death was not in the trunk but elsewhere. Anyone with common sense would know this. there would be no need for chloroform or drugs so that tells me it may have been accidental and she freaked.
Jeanne, I think the entirety of the pre-trial procedure is aimed specifically at avoiding surprises at trial. Any evidence that has not come in by the discovery deadline is normally very hard to introduce at trial unless there is a VERY good reason for the non-disclosure (like, the undercover agent could be killed if his identity is revealed, etc.). So let’s hope there are not that many.
Well I sure was suprised when they brought in that Glove and it didn’t fit OJ’s hand. And you could have knocked me over with a feather when they propped up that white hooker shoe in front of little, mild, Mary Winkler.
Hi all! Lots of good stuff on here tonight.
Traci, I live in CT, not far from Monroe where the wood chipper murder took place. I remember that well. Gross. DNA, family & friends testimony played a big part in that.
Zenga, I love all of your info – re: dna found in the maggots. I’ve said it before, LE has more evidence than we know. Can’t wait to hear.
I was talking last night on here about those garbage bins too. I know they checked the dump where they dispose, but it still nags as a possibility.
if you leave your 2 year old in a trunk i do not deam that accidental i have to assume you knew it would hurt her but was taking the chance for your social life
Sheila, I agree. Just because defense says that they have all the evidence to prove that Casey is innocent or because prosecution says that she is going down, does not make it so.
Most of evidence should be disclosed before the trial. The Judge may (and probably will) throw most of the surprises out.
Tracy – every time “absolutely” comes up, guess who I think of.
Oh, and George did leave the Sheriff’s department in 1984 – so this would have been either before Casey was born or while she was very little. Still, may be some stories were told.
Nite all and thank you for the great conversation tonight.
Has anyone thought of the possibility that Casey might change her story to something else?
i assume she will change her story and actually already has several times they are just waiting to find out how much LE have and adjust her story accordingly
Also noticed on the witness lists, no one from TN “body farm”. Are they going to use those results or no?
Thank you all, it was a pleasure to talk to you. Good night!
well wesley–I suspect your post would have gone over quite well if not for the ‘Anyone with common sense would know this’ sentence. You just simply cannot come on and imply that you are the only one with common sense. Ahh, you didn’t say that right? Since most on this thread believe that Casey drugged Caylee and put her in the trunk, I would say that’s exactly what you said. Aside from that, you do make a good point, assuming you are correct about the nighttime June temps in FL.
I have to wonder though, if George kept his books from his LE days. My husband is in LE and keeps everything. It’s enough to fill floor to ceiling shelves in the closet, and he’s only been at it for 12 years. Every class he goes to gets a 2-3″ binder, and he has lots of things on coroner’s investigations, preserving murder scenes, etc. He also has subscriptions to different LE mags, and even though George is in security, who knows? He might still subscribe to that type of thing, or have boxes of those training books in the basement.
Molly–How many guesses do I get?
Evening sleuthers
ZAK
You’ve got to start your own investigative biz–honest! In astrology Scorpio DIGS DEEP—bet you’re one.
Also CA is Gemini–so am I. That’s one of the reasons I stated WAY back she was full of it and almost everyone here stuck up for her(poor Grandma,she’s just protecting everyone,etc.) As far as Astrology goes Gemini’s with their dual personalities can weave,dodge,BS better than most anyone at the drop of a hat. Mind you now,ofcourse this doesn’t apply to me!! LOL
i think they have enough evidences for second degree yes… this is the degree most “family members” get found guily on … you know the “crimes of passion”
if she is found guilty on just this level it’s still life in prison in fla ….
Oh yeah, not to mention the nursing books Cindy might still have laying around. My mom was a nurse and I’d spend hours reading those books (closet hypochondriac back in the day LOL). Casey could have found all sorts of information regarding pharmaceuticals, doses, pediatrics…anything.
Tracy – guesses?
don’t think its anything but cindy a is a pure and simple control freak… after watch her a GA that hubby of hers is slightly lame .. honest man being cobtrolled by his wife and lame enought to get ripped off over internet con game. if you think he’s not lame aske your would you give your bank acct numbers to ANY stranger from Nigria? wow ss Ga YOU NEEDED A BETTER WIFE THAN HER
Joe D–not a huge believer in the whole astrology thing but not a Cindy fan either. Got my share of everyone taking up for Cindy too (way back). Times have changed, haven’t they.
Trust
Totally agree!
Cindy definitely a control freak. But I’m not sure I believe George lost that money in a scam.
I don’t think Casey would take the time to read anything, she did not seem like a studious type, ya know??
Tracy
They’re catching up to us! LOL
I have been thinking that if I were in a police interview and had serious comments or theories as to who did what to whom, I sure as heck would not be so inclined to discuss anything with LE after seeing how these interviews can become public knowledge.
I have noticed how some have suggested that Amy lawyer up and go after CA for suggesting that she is Zanny. It would make me so angry if I was Amy that I just might try to do that.
But…shouldn’t and wouldn’t LE be concerned about the willingness of people to speak with them candidly if their public displays begin bringing on a bunch of lawsuits and public humiliation?
This kind of thing can only hurt other investigations going forward.
where do i find the hawkins emails ?
Molly, Molly, Molly–You said to me, everytime you hear the word absolutely, GUESS who you think of. I was just ribbin’ ya.
Slightly lame? Try totally lame
I agree with you Trust, you’re very right.
They must have been in some serious financial straits for him to be so desperate (if he is indeed telling the truth about that). Especially with all the things people posted above regarding all the extravagances they had. I guess it goes back to what my parents used to tell me: anyone can go into debt.
P.S. I hope you are doing well, take care!
There are very good comments on this thread this evening and I agree with almost all of them.
You are all awesome.
Ok, I have to feel very bad for GA.. He seems honest, although it hurts him to do that when his daughter is concerned. He knows that his grandaughter was in that trunk and he knows it was KC who put her there. He is trying very hard to support his looney wife, who he does love. CA on the other hand, could care less about GA or what his opinion is about anything. CA is off in her own world of lies. And CA was right, “the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree”. KC was taught well how to lie her way through things. CA does nothing but point the finger at anyone but the person responsible for this whole mess. Amazing how that pizza went from being in the trunk for 12 days to 19 days over night?? Oh, and that stain that CA claims she and GA didn’t see, GA described it quite well and the location too… And speaking of that stain.. does anyone else thing that the FBI, in no so many words” told GA that it contained human DNA??
I never want to hear the words:
Absolutely
Red Flag
since Day One
speculate
I am sure that there are others and I will know when I hear them. Like fingernails on a chalkboard.
Drama Queen,
that’s a great point I hadn’t thought of (public humiliation from these publicized interviews). This is a dangerous practice, good thinking there….
Tracy, LOL cute Didn’t know which blurb you were referring to.
I like that “Drama Queen” moniker….
Can someone tell me was GA a homicide detective or a sherrif’s deputy? Is the homicide detective part of that just a rumor? He is very much concerned with how “smart” he thinks LE thinks he is cause he brings up the fact that he was LE some 20 years ago way too often. They are not impressed no matter how hard he tries.
Joe D,
you are so right..when I was dating, I avoided all Geminis…they were all cheaters, yet made me feel like I was crazy. They are so convincing…
SheilaB, my train of thought is that if she had enough motive to look up chloroform, missing kids, and all the other stuff she did, then yes I do think she would take the time to study crime scenes and the like. Am I saying she did do it? No; but the opportunity was definitely there. I have read the LE manuals and they are written for the layperson to understand, and most of them have detailed pictures. She wouldn’t have to strain herself too much to figure it out
Also, did anyone catch it when FBI asked GA about how the media portrayed KC? and they told him that the media was not far off?? We are all getting pretty accurate info about KC’s life after Caylee sounds like to me.
Tracy
From what I’ve heard him say in his interview, he was a homicide detective. I don’t think he was lying to the cops then, so it’s probably true.
I think the best interviews are yet to be. The ones not released. There will be some “bombshells”. ! Ha another word that makes me laugh now.
I think the Nancy Grace show would make for a great drinking game
Hmmmm.
My sister is a Gemini and never like that at all.
I am a virgo but on a cusp with Taurus. I think some of that is supposed to play into it as well? Joe D?
Guess who this is?
A dramatist, the play they are most interested in is themselves.
This is a very alert person, almost has a sixth sense as to the feelings of others; will give the public what they want before it knows what it wants.
A shy person, thru rigid self-discipline will have to overcome timidity and stage fright and to go forward in the public eye.
This person has converted timidity into sensitiveness, and fear into an understanding of other people– and after they understand them they don’t have to be afraid of them: they know how to handle them.
Emotionally, this person is acutely sensitive to impressions; will have a very romantic life, not without its ups and downs and inconstancies. Will take offense readily and can drive people crazy with the intensity of their hurt and bewilderment over apparently trifling things. They are moody and temperamental, after the manner of April day. This is a good position for material well-being.
Other traits; sensationalism needs combating, — many lovers and are likely to follow two careers, (not to mention two sweethearts) at the same time and do well at each. One way or another, they tend to lead a double life and obey the Biblical injunction of not letting the left hand know what the right hand is doing. This is okay as long as they don’t get snarled up.
Curious Dee
Lucky you didn’t date me–I’m a double Gemini in astrology jargon.Which evidently means there are FOUR of me—-I can play poker with myself!! Cards anyone???LOL
i was wanting to read the hawkins emails can anyone tell me or link me to them
oh you are dangerous,..That means Sun in Gemini
and Moon in Gemini
Casey also “dated” (? I’m being nice) LOTS of cops. I’m sure she could get some into out of them too.
I also remember that 911 call she made about the protestors. She sounded like a cop the way she was talking.
Casey changed her computer codes to
timer55
rico234
these are phone numbers for
timer55= Sean Ferrell (Raquel ferrell-Zanny accident story)
rico234 =Pat(ric)k Bourgeois – Charter boat capt Frank Bourgeois office is (352)666-6234
rico o is 6 on tellephone
Rico234 is 666-6234
what is thisaboutt?/
Patrick B 1sr visitor to jail – wore Houston cap
Drama Queen
Yea,there’s a lot involved with it—rising signs,birthsigns,cusp etc.—I know my moon is sitting in this chair!
Molly,,,,
Yes….”Bombshell!”
That’s another.
And the way NG says everynight the same opening:
“Tonight police in a desperate search for a beautiful 3 year old missing Florida toddler….Kelee.” Or however the heck she says the poor childs name.
Oh….and I thought of another thing….
George and his constant calling Caylee…”my grand daughter.” No George…her name is Caylee. CAYLEE.
Are u serious pi??? That is interesting.
Where did you find this? And you know, the “ric” I always thought it was for Ricardo. But whats with Patrick and Frank? The first two jailhouse visitors may I add. hmmm hmm
Joe D. said, “moon is sitting in this chair!
Hilarious!
Hey Joe D–can you give me an astrological profile of George?
I wish I could say I thought George was a good-guy and just out of the loop. I’m just not sure about him. I think he’s a liar as well but not as accustomed to having to find his way out of a lie. He’d just rather keep his mouth shut so he’s not in a position to have to keep up with all the stories. I also am one to believe that if you are leaving out crucial bits of information it’s not a “half-truth”, it’s a lie.
So, does anyone think that FBI told GA, without actually telling him that the stain contained human DNA?
Just wondering if the stain containing decomp fluid had tissue in it and the DNA of Caylee extracted from it, could that be considered her body? If it is proven that it did come from Caylee then wouldn’t that be considered her remains in part? I’d like to think so because Casey thinks that if there is no body she will walk. Plus, it would make sense why LE is not looking for her remains anymore. Their search would have been for evidence, not for the sake of burial.
Drama
You’re right in the way the ants speak of caylee—almost like a possession an item—gee whiz think Casey felt that way too?????????
I do astrological birth charts Joe.
The one I posted is Casey’s and I think she got snarled…lol
to say the least
Curious Dee,
I think that the person you discribe is
Casey and/or
a little bit of Cindy
lov2-
I don’t know if they told George about the stain and what it contained or not. Maybe somebody else on the threads might know.
Good question though.
Tracy
George was born under the sign of the WUSS !! But seriously,I don’t know what planet he’s from.
DQ, have you seen/listened to the video’s released yesterday?
Sherry,
Absolutely, the content of the stain would be proof it was her. Luckily Jesse did a paternity test on Caylee so LE has her entire DNA, not just from the mother’s side. Like from hairbrushes etc.
DQ – Agree, every night a bombshell. I’m not sure she says Leonards last name correct either.
Interesting you point that out about George. It’s like he’s distanced himself from Caylee. Caylee was the alive person.
Curious Dee
you do charts as a profession? I would like one
Curious Dee, on November 22nd, 2008 at 11:24 pm Said:
I do astrological birth charts Joe.
I don’t understand that. If the stain smells so bad from decomp, it should have some tissue that could be tested. But from what Kobi was saying, its just a fluid and it might not come up with any proof. I mean just how lucky can this Casey chick get??
Koby? Naaaaa don’t believe him
I went on another search tonight and found a Casey Anthony on the site where people can submit their own porn flicks. No, I didn’t click on the site-I can’t with my comp’s setup. But the description of the site gave me all I needed to know and more than I cared to know. Another thing I found out was that Det. Yuri Melich’s full title is Investigator,Child Abuse Sex Crimes. Could LE have had suspicions from the start that this particular Detective was chosen to investigate?
Curious.. I truely believe they have the DNA from the stain, and it is Caylee’s. I believe they are tying to get the gag order to keep this info out of public’s eye. I believe there is a lot more that we don’t know too.
George just strikes me as extremely nieve. He goes along to get along.
He gambles with empty promises.
If I was him and smelled what I smelled in that car and had Caylee missing there is no way in this world that I could have gone off to work that night. (if that is what he really did)
If I knew what I he knows I would not be able to stand out in the middle of the public and make the pronouncement that “the body in the back of my daughters car was not my granddaughter. ”
If I knew what he knows I would not be able to watch my wife shrivel into nothing by helping her to continue to believe something I know is not true.
Geez…I could go on and on and on about what George is and it has nothing to do with the stars. He and Cindy are in a very co-dependent relationship. Sick helps stay sick.
It is sick!
Do you think that Casey was doing one of those phone sex talk operations? She was on the phone so much and out of earshot of others.
Didn’t Melinda Duckett do her own porn flicks?
I do them on the side for friends and stuff. In the “old days” it was the cool thing to do…lol
(I’m an old hippie)
But yes, I still have the books and graphs I play around with to get a slant on certain people. Especially people like Casey. I’m trying to get into her head and see what the stars say. I’m not a big believer in the daily horoscope predictions, but natal charts fascinate me.
Koby did say that !
Curious Dee
Where’s the chart you did on Casey? I used to dabble in the Astrology stuff too—alot to it. I would say as far as Casey’s sign I would say either Virgo or Piscies–probably Piscies?
Curious——-I think her luck has run out. I can not wait to see what else they have on this girl. I think there will be suprises at trial. Maybe not for the defense but definately for all of us.
Lov2,
I watched every blessed hour of the video which were released yesterday.
During the interviews with Cindy I was really glad I drink!
Casey’s b-day is March 19
Lov2 asked:
DQ, have you seen/listened to the video’s released yesterday?
Yes, I listened to every blessed hour of the videos.
During the CA interviews I was really glad that I drink!
Just think, all the “good interviews” ahven’t been released yet.
Zak
Thanks—I was right she’s Pisces
Soory for double post. I didn’t think 1st one took.
Joe,
Its the 11:15pm post. She’s Sun in Pisces, Moon in Cancer. just a short synopsis.
====================================
Curious Dee, on November 22nd, 2008 at 11:15 pm Said:
Guess who this is?
A dramatist, the play they are most interested in is themselves.
This is a very alert person, almost has a sixth sense as to the feelings of others; will give the public what they want before it knows what it wants.
A shy person, thru rigid self-discipline will have to overcome timidity and stage fright and to go forward in the public eye.
This person has converted timidity into sensitiveness, and fear into an understanding of other people– and after they understand them they don’t have to be afraid of them: they know how to handle them.
Emotionally, this person is acutely sensitive to impressions; will have a very romantic life, not without its ups and downs and inconstancies. Will take offense readily and can drive people crazy with the intensity of their hurt and bewilderment over apparently trifling things. They are moody and temperamental, after the manner of April day. This is a good position for material well-being.
Other traits; sensationalism needs combating, — many lovers and are likely to follow two careers, (not to mention two sweethearts) at the same time and do well at each. One way or another, they tend to lead a double life and obey the Biblical injunction of not letting the left hand know what the right hand is doing. This is okay as long as they don’t get snarled up.
DQ – LOL , LOL !
DQ.. during the GA interview.. the FBI said.. ” I can’t tell you what that stain will show, but I can tell you what I think it will show”.. and they said “I think it will show human decomp.”.. do you think they might have been telling him without actually telling him?
Did any of you notice about 4-6 or so weeks ago there was a bust on child porn. About 600 people were arrested across the nation. I wondered if this case had anything to do with it.
Curious Dee
old hippies are the best hippies
I wish I were a “friend” or “stuff” LOL
Casey’s name could have been at the top of the info you
posted earlier— it does enable one to see her in another light
ZAK
Like I said earlier—-start an Investigative biz–seriously.
Joe D
And investigate who?? Gang bangers? Drug dealers?
I do need to change careers…. My family says the same thing you do; and I would LOVE that kind of business.
Lov2,
I missed how they phrased the comment to him and intonation in the voice and the body english. But…I do think that they were probably preparing him for a DNA match in the stain.
Drama Queen—–what he actually said is: “the body in the back of my granddaughters car was not my granddaughters”. Any opinions on that particular ‘freudian slip’? Do you think he just got caught up in the moment? That comment disturbs me everytime I hear him say it.
Sorry for being 5 minutes behind the conversation but am on dial-up. It’s driving me crazy.
Wow my mother’s BD was March 19th. She’s passed away now. although she had her issues as we all do, she was nothing like Casey, lucky for me lol
Excellent thought, Zak!
Speaking of which, and the post way up above about people being upset over posting children’s photos on the internet…an artist friend uses a search engine service that recognizes certain pictures or faces to find out when people have illegally stolen her work and posted it. I wonder if this would be something that could be used to search for Caylee or Casey on various sites. The difference between that search engine and most is that instead of key words that are searched, it’s points of recognition in pictures like a fingerprint. So if she was using an alias for herself or Caylee online, it wouldn’t matter.
Email me Bunny;
I needed date of birth and time. If you feel comfortable with that I’ll be happy to do a chart for you.
dmv3130@gmail.com
GA gets the hints or clues that the FBI gives him. Cindy thinks if she spins a tale long enough they will buy it. Cindy and Casey are soooooooo much alike.
GA surprised me that he lied about the gambling vs. scam. What else would he lie about to keep Casey from going to the BIG PEN? I think he would lie if it would help keep her out of there. He eludes to that in his statements.
The FBI agent basically said he didnt know what the forensics results would be, but he said he could tell George what he thought they would be and that would be “human DNA”. He leaned forward as he was saying this to make sure he had George’s full attention.
SheilaB,
The chart on Casey pertains to her date of birth including the year, so your Mom isn’t going to be exactly like her. Also you have environment. but I just wanted you to know I did her chart for Mar.19,1986.
I don’t have any other information.
Zak
Look what you’re doing NOW–with this case.This unfortunately,is only one of many that need solving–don’t you think?? You zip along with this stuff really swift and dig deep–why not make some $$ along the way—you do enjoy this work–do you not?
Tracy,
That comment by George and the body in the back of the car has always wierded me out!
In all fairness though he was not in a good way on that day.
He had just had that altercation with the two dudes near the sidewalk and had tossed their stuff all over and actually broke the guys umbrella stand. GEEZ! He really needed a chill pill.
I think he had had it!
I think he needs to believe, as he said in the interview, that Caylee is alive and Casey did nothing wrong.
But he knows differently.
On that day, I think he was having some good old fashioned emotional conflict and just blurted that statement out.
After it was all over he probably thought…WTF?
Zak, I agree that Cindy tried so hard to spin a tale and “sell” her daughter’s innocence to the FBI. It was mind boggling to watch. Interesting that she obviously “thought” she was controlling the interview. Reality is the agent just sat back and let her talk, to see what she’d give up.
NO THANKS to investigating gang bangers or drug dealers! I VALUE MY LIFE.
Corporate investigations might be good OR cheaters (LOL)
I feel better Curious Dee, I love my mommy.
Wow Zak,
That is cool stuff. I agree, you should definitely do this full time. I’m still with you on the NG and JK link.
You may be right on that or darn near close.
et has returned after pc down for a month lots of catching up to do whats up all
I read this earlier, it was posted on another thread by “Territ”, referring to Casey’s connection to Sawgrass. I wasn’t aware that she already was involved in some kind of smut business. She seems to send everyone packing & running out of town.
“Casey has a friend that lived in Sawgrass apartments for 3 years. His apartment number was “214″, which is only 4 doors away from “210″. This friend of Casey’s, for unknown reasons, packed up and moved out of Sawgrass toward the end of June.
Casey’s Sawgrass Apartment connection is also friends with a guy named
“Brandon” that operates an independent porn/adult film company, and he would use Sawgrass Apt# 214 when he would come into town and do some of his filming.
Casey’s Sawgrass Apartment friend is a bouncer/security guard for a
“gentlemens” strip club in Orlando called “Dancers Royale”. When all of this came out with Casey, “Dancers Royale” shut down their website. The reason for shutting down their website- Casey was on their home page dressed like a stripper. This ties into those “compromising” pictures,
Casey’s father found on their home computer.
Well, once again this has been great. I hope you all have a good evening.
Thanks for of the excellent discussion!
See you soon.
lots od docs to go over lol dam my pc
I’m going to change occupations and become a fulltime slacker with zero expectations,total disregard for others and eat fruit pies off my floor–wait,that sounds like a Motor co. CEO !! LOL
SheilaB
That is so true. The prosecution needs to know who is truthful so that when the trial comes the story is still the same. So, that makes sense that they let her talk. But, if it was me, I would zone out, and think “Shut up woman!” When you let them talk, they always hang themself at some point. I think that is what he was waiting for.
His arms crossed body language showed that he was listening but closing himself off in the communication. It was not OPEN communication between the two of them. Cindy was fighting her body lanuage and trying to maintain “truthful” body language.
et
if you’ve been down for a month, you have hours and hours of catch up. OH my, you’re busy now.
Molly,
Dancers Royale? Wasn’t that the strip club that Troy, Melissa and Casey went to one night near July 4th?
I remember reading that too.
I have another little tidbit to add, let me find it.
brb
molly thats old news
I believe they are going to get a conviction, but I am not sure they will get the death penalty. Although I believe when it comes time for sentencing it would be justified to end her life, and a majority of the public will pray for putting her to death I do not believe the judge will impose a death sentence. To be convicted of such a heinous crime, even if it wasn’t torture or horrendous and the child did not suffer unmercifully, the child died at the hands of someone she loved and depended on. She may have died peacefully, but any parent that could kill a child should die regardless. They should never have children if they put their wants, needs and own life ahead of the child. This sociopath has no remorse, will not admit to what she did, has no accountability of her own and will be have to be forced to take blame for what happened. The only feeling she has is sorrow and sympathy for herself because she was tied down by Caylee. She is selfish, self centered and egotistical and by virtue of displaying this she offends many people. Caylee has become a angel for and brought people together and feelings to explode because of the innocense and beauty this child possessed. She touched hearts and pulled at many strings.
I lost a friend and neighbor age 23 and her 9 month old daughter in a van and semi accident and when I got word of the accident was so unprepared, like Americans were with this case. Most of us are traumatized by such behavior. How can a parent kill a child? The child trusts them and wants them to care for them.
I do not believe enough concentration has been placed on Lee Anthony. He refused a polygraph, knows too much information, and now has gotten out of the eye. I also agree that if there was a siteing of Caylee grandparents who believed it was the child would let nothing stop them from jumping in their vehicle and searching the location for any possibility. I would not be giving lip service and give the info to the media and draw attention I would jump on it and check it out in person.
Also Cindy backing Casey , thinking that someone will harm the child if they disclose any information Casey has is bogus. If they have so much fear about the position she is in with someone, then it is even more important and more reason to go get her and bring law enforcement to protect everyone. Are they going to just leave her indefinetely if someone has her , because the fear something would happen to her. Obviously if they would hurt her if someone was closing in on them they would hurt her anyway. It is time to disclose the truth, end this sad event and stop trying to live in the media and attention Casey. I am so tired of you and ready to face whatever we encounter finding Caylee. Help your daughter. She never did anything but love you and your family.
lol ya and im on frekin dial up lol
Curious Dee
you’ve got mail from Bunny and thank you so very much
Curious Dee, on November 22nd, 2008 at 11:48 pm Said:
Email me Bunny
zak,
Oh yes, I noticed the same thing with his “closed” body language. i also enjoyed watching him react to Cindy’s lies. He would squirm every so slightly in his chair, shift his position, then settle right back into his relaxed, arms crossed, closed off self. He’s well trained, but humans are human and he did react.
I also loved it when Cindy would blab, blab, blab and then sometimes stop and look at him waiting for a response and he didn’t respond. She’d get nervous then continue blabbing some more. It was pretty interesting to watch.
i agree they will convict her as well, as far as the death pen. dont think shell get it id rather see her spend the rest of her life locked up having to live with what she did
Nice chattin with you too DQ !
ya zak looks loike cindy has him controlled
This info was posted awhile back, right after the arrest.
note the addresses are the same. It seems like an Apt. complex somewhere in Orlando.
=====================================
06/06/2006, on this date a person by the name of Brian Stenstrup, 26
Address: 2210 Yankee #334, Orlando, Florida.
was arrested in child pornography ring.
I found this information in public records.
Zenaida Gonzalez and Vincent Ortiz lived at
2210- Yankee Place, Orlando, Fl.
Along with a Miguel Hernandez, hence the Zenaida Hernandez Gonzalez name Casey gave.
Does anyone know Casey’s birth date?
I am curious as to who gave the porn/Saw Grass connection.
I show that Derrick williams rented that apt 7/25/05 for Society Entertainment. Andy Lubin is the other owner. They vacated after 2 years.
sunbiz.org-dept of state info
He issued a Youtube video stating he did not know Casey.
ID theft – she may be using the name Casey Williams….
they both know deep down she did it denial and protecting her is all
Indy Deb:
march 19, 1086
Curious Dee,
That’s interesting, any info on what dates this Zenaida lived at this address??
oops 1986 sorry..
i still think kc burned her remains
Ok-I found it-trying to avoid going into the documents again……….
cindy looks terrible
Curious – wow, good stuff there. Interesting.
Sheila
No dates, just on public record that they lived at this address. I guess someone with better software or access could find that out.
I assume LE has checked this out. The post was in regards to Jesus Ortiz as being Caylee’s father.
Zak
the stolen credit cards—didn’t they belong to an Angela Williams???
zak, on November 23rd, 2008 at 12:12 am Said:
ID theft – she may be using the name Casey Williams….
ok i need to read docs. actually all the evidence they have should convict her, dam by what we do know, thats enough for me to convict, wonder what they really have!
Casey was born on the Pisces/Aries cusp which would possibly explain the personality switching. I was born on the Aquarius/Pisces cusp. She has the energy of both signs. Pisces are naturally emotional basketcases who tend to attract unbalanced people. I’m not to informed on Aries traits, but I do have an acquaintance who is an Aries and one of the most selfish people I’ve ever met. That’s not saying all Pisces or Aries have these personality traits, but finding out that Casey was born on a cusp explains some of who she is.
there is prob plenty id theft on her part much we will never know
Curious,
Yeah I can’t imagine LE wouldn’t have followed this one up. They may have an answer to the Zenaida story and know how and why Casey used that name. I do think there is something to the photos/porn speculation though. Weird statement that the FBI agent stated right off the bat to George about what his daughter was doing for the past 2 years. He also made a statement about Casey before 20 and Casey after 20, then said, “something happened”. That was very chilling.
OMG, all of these same names keep coming up.
Bunny, remember Kiomarie Cruz who said she got a call from Casey Anthony and then changed her statement saying it was a girl named Casey Wms.
Curious Dee
Think you’re right on the money with the zeneida/Ortiz porn thing bust. Perfect excuse for Caylee’s disappearance in monsters mind–very slippery agent starling………..
kc is who she is by choice not by the stars lol
Molly, re:11:56 comment- was that on another thread on this site? Could you give the thread you got that from. TIA
The ID theft name was Angela Williams. Kiomarie said Casey Williams. And hten there is the Derrick Williams who says he knows nothing……
Curious Dee
it’s a small world—even smaller when you’re lying like Casey and her peeps
Curious Dee, on November 23rd, 2008 at 12:26 am Said:
OMG, all of these same names keep coming up.
Bunny, remember
Zak
What say you???
oh yes, Sheila,
I see where you are going now. You think she was working a phone sex or escort service? I always wondered what kc did in her spare time. She must have been “cheap”..lol Because she kept stealing money. How pathetic.
I really hope all of this comes out in the trial.
et–your not alone on the dial-up thing and it’s getting very frustrating for me.
zak–Isn’t Casey Williams the girl that was trying to get out of a bad relationship with her boyfriend and was trying to borrow money from a mutual friend of hers and Casey Anthony? Then the girl (don’t recall her name) told investigators she got the two Casey’s mixed up? Maybe I’m not understanding the ID-theft post.
wasnt cw the woman who had her credit cards used for cell phone, air tix, ect that reported to police around time caylee went missing
bbl…gnite yall
oh yea and Klomarie was willing to lend money to someone she didn’t know?
didn’t she comment on having heard a child in the background while talking to Casey?
Some are saying that if Casey was in the porn industry, why would she be stealing from others. It could be she wanted to be and put these provacative pics out there to hopefully get her break in that form of showbiz. She wouldn’t be making any income then.
Curious,
So cheap, she stole money and then went to Target to shop. Geez, if I was gonna steal, I think I’d at least upgrade to a higher end shopping spree, lol.
I’m thinking Phone sex, escort service and maybe internet porn industry?????? Something was going on and George knows. It will all come out at trial.
It was Angela or Amanda Williams who had credit card theft. The name changes on different sites. Zak could tell you for sure but it wasn’t cw – LOL
That’s what I meant earlier when I asked if anyone thought she might change her story. She may say these other “characters” were involved with Zeneida & they threatened her etc. The story may grow from just the nanny.
Also noticed that Cindy now says, “she knows who has Caylee”. She doesn’t out & out say that Zanny has her like she used to say.
Sherry – On the thread about the car reeking
Bunny–Yes, she did say she heard a child in the background but claimed later to LE that she was talking to Casey Williams and that she was sorry she got the two Casey’s mixed up. I don’t know if we’ve ever heard whether there is really a Casey Williams connected to Kiomarie. That would be interesting info. Anyone know?
Forgot to add that in my search tonight there were a few porn sites that had in their descriptions articles about death from chloroform. Interesting…
what bothers me is kcs grandmas statement with the childs voice on her ans machine i think kc prerecorded caylee to use in her kidnapping story
Sherry,
Yuck, glad you have the fortitude to do the searches. I’m too much of a coward and would have nightmares.
But please fill me in on what you find.
I would be interested to know if Casey owned any internet domains.
dam this dial up, too slow my wireless card is shot, anyway, they got kc anyway you look at ect
Lurker, I’m sure the FBI computer wiz checked all that out from her computer.
I’m sure they did too…I’m just nosy LOL
if she did le would have found them on the pcs
Time to call it a night. Chat with you all again. Have a good one.
ok i need to go catch up on the docs although its mostly things we alredy know
So George said that Casey changed at the age of 20. She was 19 at the time of Jennifer Kesse coming up missing. three months shy of turning 20.
So, Joe D.,
Are you the guy who walked up to me the other night and asked, “What’s your sign, honey?”
Anyone notice that George said he was a sheriff’s deputy for about 10 years, but only 1-1/2 years after he met Cindy, because she told him she had had enough of that, and wanted him to go into business with his dad? He also said that Cindy is not a controlling wife…
Casey probably changed at 20, because she had Caylee by then & didn’t want to be a mother.
With all the time she spent on that phone & texting, I don’t know how she had time to do anything else.
She had Caylee, but not. She became the “nanny” and Cindy was the “mother” figure in Caylee’s life. Thing is, Cindy wanted to have her cake and eat it too. She wanted Caylee, but she needed Casey to take care of her when she didn’t want to be bothered with her. Cindy is probably in denial because “on some level” she has to assume some responsibility for what has happened since Caylee’s birth.
Some of the most interesting things Cindy said in the FBI interview:
–Casey’s Pontiac wasn’t there Monday morning at Amscot, because Cindy drove by & she didn’t see it.
–She made these statements: “I can’t speculate” and “I’m not going to speculate on that.”
–When they went to the towyard, the man there told them BEFORE they went to the car that it stank, and that it stank WHEN it came in. (Didn’t she deny this publicly?)
–I found it very interesting when she made this remark: “I think there was a pair of Casey’s pants in the trunk.” (Ya think?)
Elaine,
Poor Georgie, he’s so controlled by Cindy and he doesn’t even know it. Of course, if he didn’t know not to get involved in an internet scam, then……well..what can I say. George seems to lacking good common sense.
SheilaB,
This is so true. My heart goes out to him, but he is so dumb!!! He could have done so much better than CA…
Elaine – Totally agree. Cindy has guilt in all of this & that’s why she backs up Casey now. In some twisted way she’s trying to “fix” all of this. Poor George, just along for the ride, but he KNOWS.
A few more things Cindy said that cause me to raise my eyebrows:
–She described the “unique” smell of rotting flesh, and maintained that it was not the same smell as she smelled in the trunk of Casey’s car.
–But then she added the following: “I’ve never smelled a 19 day old pizza!”
–Another quote: “Something was really rank in that car.”
SheilaB, I just searched because of those photos the investigator told GA about. I didn’t want to think they were porn pics but just provacative. But I had to know if it was possible. Ha! Of course it is! We’re talking about Casey! I don’t think I’ll do anymore searches on that- the descriptions for these sights were more than I could take to read. Gross perversions out there on the net. I just remembered, someone who worked at Disney, Charles Hurrey was arrested for child porn. Don’t remember the date, though. Click on any of the news sites here and do a search on that name.
He does know. But he has no one to confide in. I know he’s hurting. I’m sure Cindy is hurting as well, but it is very difficult for me to feel sorry for her. She is just obstinate.
Elaine & Sheila – Dont’ think this marriage wil make it after all is said & done.
There were some bloggers here who thought of child porn very early in this investigation. I hate to think about it, but who knows. Caylee may have been hurt or even killed while taking part in something like that. It is sick…
Molly,
You know what, I don’t either. It has only barely made it this long. I expect Cindy to have some sort of breakdown before this is over, and George needs someone he can be honest with and someone he can confide in. Cindy’s not fitting the bill.
Sherry C – Casey WAS in porn photos ?
I think there is plenty of evidence. I’m a little confused at some of the prosecution’s tactics, but I trust them to do their best. There are parts missing from a lot of the documents & tapes that have been released.
When Lee questioned Casey about why they couldn’t go get Caylee that first night, July 16, Casey told him:
–”I don’t want to disrupt her life because from here on out Caylee’s life will never be the same”, (quote from Casey to Lee before police arrived)
Earlier when Cindy threatened to take her to the police if Casey didn’t take her to Caylee:
–”I can’t take you to Caylee tonight”, Casey told her mom.
As soon as I saw that guy was arrested for child porn, I thought, noooo, I can’t even go there to think Caylee was “used” for that. Brings tears to my eyes.
Does also fall in with the chloroform thing though.
Molly-
Was this ever confirmed about her picture being on the DR website? I thought it was just someone who people thought looked like her….but I would believe it.
*********************************
The reason for shutting down their website- Casey was on their home page dressed like a stripper. This ties into those “compromising” pictures,
Did you hear Cindy say that she sprayed Febreze in the trunk to try and get rid of the odor? I wonder what that has in it? Any chloroform?
Elaine – Before Cindy called 911, Casey also said, “I’ll get her tomorrow or bring her here tomorrow” something like that. Tha’ts when Cindy said No, you’ve had 30 days, no more.
Molly, the pics were called provacative, not porn, per se. But the investigator seemed to be apologetic to George about these pics already being online and he couldn’t keep them from being made public.
Blackcat – Don’t know if that’s confirmed. It wouldn’t surprise me though.
At that point, Molly, Casey was trying to stop Cindy from calling police, but she said that earlier, I think in the car before they got back to the house, Casey had told her she couldn’t, as if it were not possible. I’m not sure what is going on in Cindy’s muffin-topped head, but she for sure is trying to convince herself that Casey did not murder Caylee. As a matter of fact, this is from the video with FBI:
–”Common sense tells me that Casey didn’t do it,” she said.
–(about the possibility that Caylee’s dna might be found in the car) “We’ve all driven that car… Our things have been in it, including our sweaty clothes….”
–”We know every stain in that car. When we first looked in the trunk we didnt see any new stains.”
–”I told them I sprayed fabreze.”
–With determination and conviction she told the FBI agent, “Casey did not murder Caylee. She did not murder that child.”
I notice she said “we” know every stain in that car. She’s speaking for George now too? And were they looking for new stains?
muffin head – lol too funny
Although I am not a molecular scientist (and can barely spell it), I found a connection between Chloroform & Cyclodextrin, the active ingredient in Febreze. Cindy said she sprayed Febreze in the trunk to try to mask the odor.
——————————
Abstract: The unusual self-assembly in chloroform of a novel cyclodextrin-based [2]pseudorotaxane, composed of heptakis-2,6-di-O-methyl-3-O-acetyl-β-cyclodextrin and a viologen-containing linear component, is reported.
Keywords: supramolecular chemistry; cyclodextrin; pseudorotaxane; viologen.
Whatever that means…..
From what little I saw of the interview, George just hunge his head a couple times so not to look at the guy. He’s embarrassed & just doesn’t know what to do.
Bunny,
Yes Kiomarie did say that:
This is what I found in my notes:
worked together with Casey, rec’d call from Casey on July 9th,asked to borrow $150/$200. Said she heard child in background; mommy, mommy. Per sworn statement. Also pointed out wooden area she and Casey would hang out at as kids.
So Molly, you don’t happen to have a degree in molecular science, do you? I sure would like to know if the chloroform came from something Casey or Cindy sprayed in the trunk. There has already been info released that Casey bought deodorant sprays, and there just happens to be chloroform in some aerosol sprays…
C. Dee,
Kiomarie also changed that story later. She said she had mixed up Casey Anthony with Casey Williams, who also had a little girl close to Caylee’s age. It was added to her original statement as a change in her story. I think she is on the witness list, isn’t she?
This is a little different than the topics that have been discussed here, but did anyone else notice that George told the FBI that Casey’s ID was in the purse in the car… But, Lee said Casey’s ID was in the purse he brought home from Tony’s. Then Lee went on to say there was something else under her ID that looked like another ID but the cop grabbed it before he could see what it was for sure. Sounds like to me, that Casey may have been having fake IDs made up. Maybe that is why the target cashiers didn’t question the ID that she gave them to cash checks. That still doesnt’ explain why the one didn’t notice she signed casey anthony to check belonging to Amy though.
Isn’t there a simple recipe for making chloroform – bleach and something else that you can buy anywhere. I’m sure the Fabreeze thing will come up at trial.
And here I am spraying the stuff around my house.
Elaine,
You never cease to amaze me: Febreze was sprayed in Casey’s trunk. And Chloroform & Cyclodextrin is the active ingredient of Febreze. Geesh, what else are we going to find?
dsgf,
Yes, it is strange that George said that. I wonder if he may be mistaken? The towtruck driver said he did not see a purse in the car. All he saw was the carseat and some shoes and toys. But I think that Cindy also said Casey’s “regular” purse was in the car. I don’t think she mentioned the id though.
Well, I don’t know, but since they first said there was so much chloroform, I have been trying to figure it out. There is chloroform in many aerosols. Casey supposedly bought “deodorizers” and Cindy said she sprayed Febreze in the trunk, so I just wonder if that will explain some of the chloroform.
Cindy’s interview was very difficult to listen to. I only listed to one part at a time. I had to have a couple of hours or so between each one. She makes my blood boil…
Gotta go, ‘night all…
To me, Cindy’s interview was all about “red flags” with Orange County Sheriff’s dept and Ricardo and Amy. According to her, the police weren’t doing thier job and Ricardo and Amy must be Zanny since that pic was taken in Ricardo’s apt. She couldn’t except the fact that Casey just flat out lied about where Caylee had been, she had to make it about some kind of word association game. And George knows that the smell in the truck could be Caylee, knows that he may have to come to grips that his daughter murdered her own flesh and blood but still wants to try and involve Jesse Grund. They really just make me tired with all their denial, it has to be wearing on them if it makes me so tired listening to it. They actually have to rationalize it in their heads.
Good detective work Elaine ! We’ll all solve this case yet. All that spraying didn’t cover the smell though.
dsgr – I don’t think the target girl even looked at the printed name & the signed name. I don’t think they’re that into it.
Well, nice chatting with you all. See ya tomorrow.
txschoolnurse,
are you still here?
The chloroform was saturated in 3 areas. This is different from airborne molecules. Liguid saturation parts per million…. would be extremely high compared to airborne or gas type molecules ( far less parts per million). I read that it was Febreze dryer sheets that contain chloroform. My spray contains water, alcohol, odor eliminator from corn, and fragrance. Chloroform as anaesthesia was banned in the 1970s. Any way that people would breathe the chloroform naturally would be a potential lawsuit. In other words, if the product could be inhaled, potential death could result, and this could become a lawsuit against the manufacturer.
Febreze in dryer sheets are chloroform in a solid form, and would rub off on skin; however, this is not the intent of the manufacturer. Also, it would take a lot of dryer sheets to induce death.
I haven’t seen this before.
Where did Cindy find the backpack, I wonder?
===========================
In Cindy Anthony’s interview with Orange Co. detectives on Aug. 4, she recalled finding Caylee’s backpack in the days after she realized her granddaughter was missing.
“There were no clothes in there like there would be. There was a couple of diapers in there, her toothbrush, a couple hair things,” said Cindy Anthony. “And then maybe some wipes and that was it. Which is unusual cause their backpacks are usually full to the brim and usually books, toys, clothes.”
ok, another question, ive said and wondered if casey used chlorphorm as a baby sitter, however on nacny grace,LP insinuated that zani, was not the sitters nic name but that zani was the street nic name for zanax,, a tranqulizer,,,
was casey getting the zani’s from the crowds at the fusion for caylees new baby sitter,, and over did it w/ the chlorphorm as a nite sitter or a strong cleaner to get rid of the odor?
I think Amy and Ricardo know a lot more than we think.
Here is another bit of evidence the state has that has not been mentioned. If killer was using Xanax as the perfect, silent Zanny the babysitter, there will be traces of it in the little girl’s hair. I know they have that cadaver hair from the trunk but I believe they also have hair from her brush which they used to compare samples. Those samples, from a live Caylee will tell exactly what drugs she had been given over time.If Xanax is one of those drugs – well, then it’s a slam dunk, isn’t it?
What is it you think A & R know?
Good morning Holden. I sure do hope so that if Zanax was used that it would be shown in the hairbrush hair. I will go out on a limb with Amy and Ricardo. Ricardo had a website with a poster on it of a man and woman and it said something about making her yours with chloroform. Thats how Padilla figured the chloroform had something to do with sex. I saw the poster but its been removed from the site now. Now, this is a reaching speculation but it could be they were into making porn movies. I have a hard time with implicating Amy, but with Ricardo, I’d believe it if its true.
One thing I am very curious about is how many interviews with GA and CA did LE do? And I wonder if the FBI questioned them at all, or if it is completely an OCSO investigation. I would love to see this FBI agent question them. These tapes we watched were not an interrogation. Cindy (and George?) had contacted the FBI because they were concerned that tips were not being followed up on, and that OCSO was not looking for an alive Caylee, but only trying to build a case against Casey. These little chats were to reassure them on that count, and they allowed them to chatter on as long as they wanted to. Remember the other video we have seen of Cindy with OCSO, working on the calendar? She starts out talking on her cell phone with Scott from the FBI about the tips, so the tapes released Friday happened before the OCSO interviews.
Good Morning,
This is an interesting article about a death that occured while using chloroform during a sex act.
Yikes!
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7326676.stm
Morning all. Gosh when Joe D said “I think Casey is a Pisces” I thought..oh no..oh no. Sure enough she is. Me too. Hummm.
From what I know, folks born under our sign are dreamers and talented people. I don’t think killers. Pretty much control folks.
I think a lot of Casey would fall under “a product of her environment”
Do you think the FBI agent asigned to sit and listen to CA was being punished. He must be at the bottom of the think tank. Can you imagine that assignment.
Yowsers.
I don’t think Casey would sit and read a lot of manuals. Remember everybody said he was great with the computer. I am sure that was her education.
A person that reads a lot has a better way with words , grammer and spelling. I don’t see that in her texting and emails I have read. Althought I question my last statement because thats what she has been doing since landing in the clink.
Good Morning Jeanne!
I had to laugh when I read your comment about the poor FBI agent. I imagine he wondered what his superiors must think about him since he recieved that assignment. LOL
Casey also has a genetic component along with environmental factors. A double whammy.
Her mother clearly demonstrates some kind of psychiatric illness; perhaps bi-polar tendencies.
Maybe Cindy has never been diagnosed.
It is also interesting about text messaging. It is almost a language unto itself.
It has to be in order to cram a lot of words into valuable space in order to save money.
Of course with as many messages as KC sent it appears money was not an issue until she got the bill.
Good morning everyone. A couple of passing comments: Zak, when you spray febreze, there is liquid saturation as well as air. Chloroform is a fairly common household product chemical (various amounts in rugs, textiles, cleaners, even some insulation) and product liability is easily avoided with the label warning. I am not saying the chloroform in the trunk came from febreze (there had to be a couple of galons of that stuff poured into the trunk for enough concentration), but that is also not proof that Caylee died from it.
Microscopic tissue remains and decomposing body fluids are not considered to be a “body” according to Florida case law, there has to be something more substantial.
However, solid decomposition evidence with specific DNA, but without a body, has been enough to get a manslaughter conviction in FL. Everywhere I looked, for the 1st degree you have to have a definite cause of death. For example, if it was established that Casey purposefully drugged Caylee and/or abandoned her in the car and the child died, say, of chloroform od, or of overheating, then the death occurred during intentional commission of aggravated child abuse, intent to kill at that point is not necessary – 1st degree it is, because the lesser felony WAS the proximate cause of death. With no cause of death this would be hard to do. Even if body is found now, it will probably be in a bad enough shape for the cause of death to not be easily determinable.
With holding back interviews and other evidence – it is perfectly justified during the investigation stage. However, once indictment/charge is made and the case goes to judicial proceeding, the info to be used at trial has to be made available to all parties and, unless the judge seals it, is publicly accessible. It does not have to come out all at once, of course (can be supplemented), but has to be fully disclosed by the end of discovery.
Also, expert reports (DNA, etc.) do not have to be accompanied by testimony of people preparing them – parties can bring their own experts to interpret the findings (I think there just was a supreme court case about this). So if you don’t see anyone from the “body farm” on the witness lists, does not mean that the reports will not be used. There should be a list of documents/expert testimony/other evidence to be used at trial coming soon from both sides – that would be a better indicator of what will be introduced at trial.
It would be interesting to find out how Baez is being paid. Even of he is doing it pro bono for a pr benefit (which is sort of risky), I can’t imagine the expert witnesses are in it because of the goodness of their hearts. That’s at least $250 per hour for evidence review, another $500 for the report and more money for travel/trial testimony. Additional fees for the expert lawyer Baez brought in. George and Cindy are not paying for Casey – someone has to be.
Thank you for your time – you all are wonderful to talk to!
Jeanne….yes, I think that poor FBI guy who listened to GA was being punished for something. I felt like I was being punished he went on and on and on…..so boring. At least with CA those lies and the way she changed the whole Zanny/baby/amy/ricardo thing around was pretty entertaining. But they do drone on and I do believe the FBI agent was stiffling yawns. Law Student….your posts are always so thorough, so thoughtful I have to take my time reading them. Thanks for taking time out of what must be very busy days to post.
i’ve been wondering about the money thing too.. very odd.
And after watching (forcing myself) these videos, the one true thing cindy has said is that “the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree”.
Have mercy.. can you imagine living in that house?
Hi Mia,
I especially cannot imagine living in that house since the tapes were released.
Rut roh.
Good morning all. (I posted this last night but for those who went to bed early, here it is again).
The easiest Casey way to dispose of the body would undoubtly be a dumpster. Everyone seems focused on the Amscot dumpster, but just because she left her car there doesn’t mean that’s the dumpster she used. I believe she was watching for a trash removal truck making their early morning rounds and then went ahead a little and used a dumpster that she knew would be picked up in a few minutes. I believe she waited in the shadows in the hours just before sun up to make sure that dumpster was off loaded and then . . . she made her way to Amscot and ditched the car. At that point, she was certain that the body was headed for the landfill and that was that. Done…nice and easy. LP said she would not have been able to lift a body up and into a dumpster, but many dumpsters have side doors. We have one behind our business in a small strip mall…out of sight of the main street … and easy…very easy.
So much time had passed since she disposed of the body in a dumpster that I doubt a search of a landfill would unearth anything. I’m no expert on landfills for sure, but surely not all trash companys utilize computerized systems to track where they dump their loads. My hubby drives a concrete truck and his truck has a GPS that lets his dispatcher know exactly where he is at all times. The large trash removals companies like EWS (Environmental Waste Services) here in Florida probably have GPS technology in their newer trucks. But, smaller independant trash removal companys, like the ones owned by your average Joe 6-pack, probably don’t have the technology. Anyway…that’s my theory and I’m stickin’ to it.
WL,
I totally agree.
I would not use a dumpster right next to where I parked the car in which I had the body.
It would be best to use some other dumpster.
Plus, I have lifted heavy trash bags into tall dumpsters and I am 5′2 inches and weigh 109 lbs.
KC does not look immaciated. She looks athletic. I think she could hoist Caylee into a dumpster if she put her mind to it.
If I had to do it (and God knows I never will) I could.
My two cents.
Yeah, I think she was so desperate at that point that she probably could have lifted the dumpster itself.